Today. How you could stay alive by ordering delivered pizza. It is the only time a humane idea to have things delivered by drones. Big thing i wanted to know and asked bill to go out and measure and i want to know exactly how many inches of snow fell on grayson street in dorchester, the street i grew up on. By a storm named grayson. Grayson. Come on. We have to snow. Grayson street hurt by this . With this storm, snow and how much of the tide came down grayson street in dorchester. Its on a hill and safe from the flooding but, rachel, this the New York Times story corroborated by the ap during your hour. They have come out and said they found exactly the same thing about the president s reaction to the sessions recusal and trying to prevent it. The actively trying to prevent it. Which adds to this issue, the frame, anyway, of the issue of obstruction of justice. Actually saying hes supposed to be there to protect me. This attorney general. We talked with chuck rosenberg, the former chief of staff of the fbi about this earlier this hour and he made an important point. I dont know enough about recusal and just governed by, you know, norms opposed to laws. I dont know if you could potentially obstruction justice trying to influence somebodys decision to recuse themselves from your case and he said essentially its a gray area and if you did it with the intention, if you took that action, you lobbied for the recusal with the intention of keeping somebody in place who would be loyal to you to protect you from prosecution, then, yeah, this might look like another element of obstruction of justice and the president might personally be liable. The legal niceties to be worked out by people at a higher pay grade than us but this is if this is corroborated information now, this is serious stuff for the white house. Well, the president had the obvious, ongoing intention to tell his attorney general what to do in relation to this investigation. And so, to urge him not to recuse himself is to urge him to remain in place so i, the president , continue to tell him what to do and might be telling him to do is obstruct justice in effect. Yes. If the president is on the record in some provable way saying the reason i want this recusal and expect this recusal and will be angry if i dont get this recusal is because i want him unrecused so i dont get prosecuted, well that if that can be proven and corroborated and notes of people in the white house testifying to say they saw the president say that, that that is how you build an obstruction of justice case against anybody and including the president of the United States. Well find out what the special prosecutor knows. Thank you, rachel. Thank you, lawrence. Tonights breaking news of the New York Times intersects with the breaking news being made on virtually every page of Michael Wolffs new book fiery and fury inside the Trump White House. The New York Times reporting new details about the special prosecutors investigation of possible obstruction of justice by President Trump while Michael Wolffs book reports that the spokesperson for trumps legal team resigned because he believed that he had become a witness to a likely obstruction of justice committed by the president on air force one. The New York Times is reporting tonight, quote, President Trump gave firm instructions in march to the white houses top lawyer, stop the attorney general Jeff Sessions from recusing himself in the Justice Departments investigation. Don mcgahn, the white House Counsel, then urged Jeff Sessions not to recuse himself and then relented when Jeff Sessions told him that on the advice of Career Justice Department officials Jeff Sessions had already decided but not yet announced that he would, indeed, recuse himself. When mcgahn reported that to the president , the times said, the president erupted in anger in front of numerous white house officials saying he needed his attorney general to protect him and asked where the roy cohn . He was the disgraced lawyer who worked for the disgraced alcoholic republican senator Joseph Mccarthy in the 1950s who terrorized washington with false accusations of communist activity in the government. Roy cohn went on to a life of continued disgrace and dishonor in new york city as a criminal lawyer representing such clients as mafia kingpin john gotti and kingpin donald trump. Roy cohn disbarred and banned from practicing law in 1968. And that, that is who donald trump wishes was still at his side tonight in the white house. The New York Times is reporting tonight that special prosecutor Robert Mueller has substantiated the claims that former fbi director james comey, quote, made in a series of memos describing troubling interactions with the president before he was fired in may. The special counsel received handwritten notes from mr. Trumps former chief of staff Reince Priebus showing that mr. Trump talked to mr. Priebus about how he called mr. Comey to urge him to say publicly that he was not under investigation. The New York Times has also learned that four days before mr. Comey was fired one of mr. Sessions aides asked a Congressional Staff member whether he had damaging information about mr. Comey, part of an apparent effort to undermine the fbi director. The attorney general wanted one negative article a day in the news media about mr. Comey according to a person with knowledge of the meeting. Before firing mr. Comey, the president spent a weekend working on a letter the president intended to send to mr. Comey, the letter was never sent. The special prosecutor has obtained a copy of that letter. The tikts reporting tonight that the first sentence of that letter said that the russia investigation had been, quote, fabricated and politically motivated. After the president fired james comey, the New York Times reported that the president had asked james comey to shut down the fbi investigation of Michael Flynn in the day after the times reported that Deputy Attorney general Rod Rosenstein acting in the place of recused attorney general Jeff Sessions announced the appointment of Robert Mueller as special prosecutor. According to the times, quote, mr. Trump erupted at mr. Sessions upon hearing the news in an oval office meeting. The president said the attorney general had been disloyal for recusing himself from the russia investigation and told mr. Sessions to resign. Mr. Sessions sent his Resignation Letter to the president the following day and mr. Trump rejected it sending it back with a handwritten note at the top, not accepted, the note said. Tonights the New York Times reporting intersects with Michael Wolffs new book on a Central Point in the investigation of obstruction of justice and that is the president s role last summer in telling white house employees what to say to the New York Times when the times discovered that donald trump jr. Had a meeting in trump tower in the president ial campaign with russians who claimed to have dir on Hillary Clinton, a meeting attended by the president s soninlaw Jared Kushner and Campaign Chairman paul manafort. From air force one President Trump dictated what the response to the New York Times should be. Tonight the New York Times is reporting, quote, mr. Mueller has also been examining a false statement that the president dictated on air force one in july in response to an article in the times about a meeting the Trump Campaign officials had with russians in 2016. The times goes on to quote portions of Michael Wolffs book and version of that meeting. Heres how Michael Wolff describes the air force one meeting led by the president on what to say to the New York Times. Included in the discussion on the plane were the president , hope hicks, Jared Kushner and ivanka trump and spokesperson josh raffel. Ivanka would leave the meeting, take a bill and go to sleep. Jared, in the telling of his team, might have been there but he was not taking a pencil to anything. The meeting would shortly receive the special counsels close scrutiny with the relevant question being whether one or more federal employees had induced other federal employees to lie. Agrieved unyielding and threatening president dominated the discussion, pushing into line his daughter and her husband hicks and raffel insisting the meeting at trump tower purely and simply about russia adoption policy. Thats what was discussed, period. It was a realtime example of denial and coverup. The persistent trump idea is it is not a crime to lie to the media was regarded by the legal team as at best reckless and in itself potentially actionable. Explicit attempt to throw sand in the investigations gears, the spokesperson for the Trump Legal Team was instructed not to speak to the press, indeed, not to even answer his phone. Later that week, he seen no good outcome and privately confided he believed the meeting on air force one represented a likely obstruction of justice quit. Joining us now, steve is mit, strategist and analyst, natasha bertrand, correspondent at Business Insider and matt miller, former chief spokesman for the Justice Department and msnbc justice and security analyst. On monday night, Michael Wolff will join us on this program in his first prime time cable news interview about this book and so well be able to go over all much more of the details in it but, matt miller, i want to get your reaction to what youre reading in the New York Times tonight as it intersects with Michael Wolffs book about that meeting that mark caralo upon reflection decided to quit because he felt he had possibly gotten too close to an obstruction of justice case. I think what were learning tonight is the obstruction case is much more advanced than we know. One of the things is proving intent and with the president its his own words. He comes out and tells you exactly what he was intending to do and makes the case that much stronger. You know, we saw this last year when he explained, you know, two days after firing james comey, explained to lester holt it was all about the russia investigation and now we see it again when, you know, his urging Jeff Sessions not to recuse, you could come up with some plausible, legitimate reason why he was urging that. You know, should have been meddling and come up with an idea that, you know, he thought that the attorney general needed to be in charge of the departments most important investigation. But trump, cant seem to help himself, tells all of his aides in a roomful of witnesses, no, what he wants is an attorney general who would protect him. The way that roy cohn would or he thought that rfk protected his brother, mistakenly thought that my former boss eric holder protected president obama. It is trumps own mouth, his own confession in front of roomful of witnesses that may end up sealing his case for obstruction of justice and with respect to the meeting on the plane, lock, trump is right its not a crime to lie to the press but if the president has obstructed justice and if people around him have entered into a conspiracy to obstruction justice any action that he takes to further the conspiracy is something that will be used in court or in the impeachment context, using it in a em peachment proceeding to prove that case and concealing the truth of that meeting in trump tower in 2016 seems to be exactly what theyre trying to do and looks like we have very clear evidence and i would expect that mark carollo not in to see bob muellers team, they will hear from him shortly. Steve schmidt, your reaction to the needing roy cohn . It seems remarkable just a couple of days into the new year when were looking at the speed of stories unraveling thats happening around this president , around the oval office. Specifically, lawrence, this week began with what i would call an outburst of digital mccarthyism. The insinuation that the department of justice, the intelligence communities Work Together in a conspiracy against the American People. This is exactly the type of allegations and insinuations that mccarthy made. And of course, it is also autocrat in intent because at the heart of every autocracy is a notion of conspiracy, the insidious fifth column working against the people who can only be protected by their leader who needs extra judicial powers and its okay to violate democratic norms to put down the conspiracy. Its frightening, frankly. Again, we see that with the actions on the airplane, of course, whether it was a crime or not, the special counsel will determine but we know that the president of the United States was engaged in premeditatedly lying to the American People and in every instance as is always the case since they made the first representations denying that there was any involvement with russians, every instance the administration has been found to be lying on all of these issues and, of course, we see in this book the chaos, the incompetence, the recklessness, the unpreparedness around the most powerful person of the world of the menageri e. Looking at the comportment in this majestic place, the west wing of the white house, they couldnt be more vile than if theyre monkeys hurling excrement at each other in a cage. The New York Times reporting tonight comes after an article Michael Wolff published today explaining how he got access to the Trump White House and adding some more detail about what he picked up there. And yet, it is one thing he wrote this morning i think is makes a lot more sense as you read the New York Times article tonight when you see the president s reaction in the New York Times article to his attacks on Jeff Sessions and so forth, what Michael Wolff wrote this morning, about people in the white house, no one expected him to survive mueller. Whatever the substance of the russia collusion, trump in the estimation of his senior staff did not have the discipline to navigate a tough investigation, nor the credibility to attract the caliber of lawyers he would need to help him. And natasha, in the accounts of the New York Times tonight, that is certainly someone who does not have the discipline to survive a close investigation. Another thing that wolff wrote is that trump had recently been urging fox news to levy attacks on mueller. To essentially serve as a surrogate and attack mueller where he could not. Look. I think this is all indicative of why james comey never came out and said you are not under investigation because by that point by the time that he actually had spoken to trump and by the time that he testified before congress, trump had already asked him to drop the investigation into Michael Flynn. Trump asked him for loyalty. These are thing that is james comey was considering potentially most likely when he was debating whether or not to publicly exonerate trump and probably knew sometime in the near future he might be under investigation of obstruction of justice and requesting for months at the time. Matt, if and well never know the sequence of this, if the president was not under investigation before, he asked james comey to drop the Flynn Investigation, the very act of asking the fbi director to drop the Flynn Investigation probably apparently put the president under investigation as of that moment. The fbi director immediately rushed off to write notes that he needed to record of that actual conversation. Yeah. Look. James comey testified he took the notes because he thought that some point his integrity would be questioned, people would wonder what happened in the meetings and would need an account of that. I believe him but i have also thought he was after hearing the inappropriate requests of the president starting to build a case, starting to build an obstruction case of the president that very moment. One of the questions people asked why didnt you do something more and tell the president to stop . You know, why didnt you go to the boss and did veal eventually do . I think we had a witness incriminating himself, committing criminal acts or potentially criminal acts and wanted to record those and let him keep going and get as much of it as he could down and, of course, we now know that those in