Transcripts For MSNBCW The Last Word With Lawrence ODonnell

I also want to tell you there is a press conference expected in austin given the series of explosions that weve been monitoring. Weve been reporting on this. Youre looking at the footage there where we expect to get Law Enforcement authorities to come out and detail what they know at this late hour about the series serial bombings. Were going to monitor it in our control room tonight. And if we see Important News coming out of that or important disclosures, we will bring it to you as as soon as we get it. And a lot of people keeping their eye on what has been a very unpredictable situation in austin, texas. Well keep an eye on that. The other big story, though, that is our top story is a move away from not only the criminal probe by bob mueller that has put so much heat on donald trump. Tonight at least that criminal case has been overshadowed by three cases in civil court brought by women who say they deserve their day in court. Now ill tell you straight up tonight. We didnt choose to bring you these three cases. This isnt some kind of editorial decision to compare three different women suing trump or looking at their legal arguments. This is literally the news breaking on all three of these separate cases right now. Ra new woman filing suit today. Another who won a procedural step as the judge green lights her case today. And the third, Stormy Daniels releasing new evidence in her case that dates back far before the president ial campaign. So let me begin with a brief explanation, though, of the newest case filed today by karen mcdougal. She is a former playboy model. She is suing the National Enquirers Parent Company saying she deserves the right to speak about her alleged relationship with trump dating back to 2006. Now she says she signed a deal before the 2016 election for 150,000 that would enable the enquirer to basically silence her story. But now she says she views that contract as void. She says she was tricked into signing it while being misled as to its contents including by her very own lawyer. Then case number two, a judge clearing the path for a defamation suit against donald trump by former the apprentice contestant summer zervos. He put me in an embrace, and i tried to push him away. I pushed his chest to put space between us, and i said come on, man, get real. He repeated my words back to me. Get real as he began thrusting his genitals. He tried to kiss me again with his michigan hands still on his chest, and i said dude, youre tripping right now. Attempting to make it clear i was not interested. Many republicans argued bill clinton should face exactly these kind of civil lawsuits while he was president. And thats the exact case that was cited against donald trump today. The judge noting no one is above the law. Its settled. The president has no immunity and is subject to the laws for purely private acts. Then case three. News breaking today about Stormy Daniels Lie Detector Test. Her lawyer joins me in a moment releasing this picture of a test she took in 2011 to support her claims for an interview she did with intouch magazine about this alleged sexual relationship with donald trump. This is definitely newsworthy because it undercuts an attack made on daniels, that the whole dispute was just about the 2016 election. The new material shows some of the lengths she went to support her story back in 2011 when the idea of donald trump being president of the United States was widely considered a joke. Ha ha ha. Here we are. Now, does the tested self mean everything she said is automatically true . As a matter of law, courts dont admit the tests. They have about a 70 accuracy rate. This asked if she had intercourse with trump, whether it was unprotected and whether he offered to get her an appearance on the apprentice. The examiner asserting she passed the test clearly. Lawyer avanatti says he paid for the tape. We caught wind of the fact there were a number of main party, some in the Mainstream Media that were attempting to purchase the video and the file for use in what i will describe as nefarious activities. That very lawyer in the eye of the storm joins me now. Michael avenatti. Thanks for being here. Thanks for having me. This case stays in the news, partly because there seems to be new evidence that comes out. For new viewers, what is the import of it . Well, i think you put your finger on it, ari. The import is that back in may of 2011, my client sat in a room in las vegas with a licensed polygraph examiner. Was given a polygraph examine, and she passed with flying colors. I do want to correct one thing. The three questions you put up, she passed the first two. It was determined she was telling the truth. As to the third, as to whether she was promised a spot on the apprentice, the polygraph examiner concluded that it was inconclusive. So he did not conclude she was telling the truth. He did not conclude she was lying. It was inconclusive. You know that i strive to be very accurate as it relates to the information that comes out. And so when i see something that is not quite right, i want to make it known. So that was the detail. Appreciate that nuance. It is a nuance, but its important. Because we dont want the get over the tips of our skis. But i think its important because weve heard various attacks on my client relating to her motivations for doing this. People have said that she was trying to blackmail a president ial candidate in the waning days of the election, which is patently false. And its one of the things that i think is most important about this. Now, look, this is another piece of evidence. And its another document thats being presented to the American People. They can go online. They can download it. They can read it for themselves. They dont have to take your word for it, my word or anybody elses word. There is going to be this interview that is going to be broadcast on sunday where the American People are going to be able to observe my clients demeanor and hear her answers. And theyre going to be able to judge for themselves as to whether she is telling the truth or not. And this has always been what weve said for weeks. Now dont take my word for it or someone elses word for it. You should hear from my client. Hear her story. Hear her version of events and judge for yourself. And to the extent that mr. Cohen or the president have a counternarrative or a different version of the facts, they should go on a show, have a press conference, they could do any number of things and explain their version. Youre giving donald trump media advice. Let me read to you from Michael Cohen. Speaking out to vanity fair, daniels said her number was 130,000. Cohen relates it was strange. A not entirely round number. But he accepted. He asked this lawyer why she would tell her story when she previously denied it. Quote, he said she needed the money. I didnt come up with this number. That false . Absolutely. And were going to prove its false. Here is the best thing that i can say about mr. Cohens verse veracity. Here is the best thing i can say. Highly suspect. So Michael Cohen in your view is not telling the truth about your client needing money. Why . Well, i dont think he is telling the truth about a whole host of things, starting with the fact that he wants the American People to believe that he drafted this agreement on his own, negotiated it on his own. Mr. Trump never knew anything about it, didnt have anything to do with the payment. And by the way, here is an interesting question, ari. If thats to be believed, then why is mr. Trumps signature line in the agreement . Why is he listed as a party . And why did he jump into it on friday . I want to bring in our panel, and stay with me. This is very important question. Its a very simple one. If the whole plan was that mr. Trump was never going to be a party to the agreement and was never going to sign it, wasnt even going to know about it because mr. Cohen, his very close friend didnt want to bother him in the waning days of the campaign, and he was just going to pay the money and never even tell mr. Trump about it, then why did mr. Cohen draft an agreement with mr. Trumps name littered throughout the document with a signature line for him to sign . I will tell you my legal analysis. I think its a good question. Stay with me. As promised, i want to bring in matt miller, former sparm for attorney general holder, msnbc analyst as well as joyce vance, and joyce, when you hear this and you hear the lawyers fighting and you see the lie detector come out, what is your view of the wider significance . Lie detector tests are really interesting, ari. Youve noted that theyre not admissible in court, and thats because their scientific validity hasnt been established yet. Not to say it couldnt be done in the future. And perhaps this would be the case. But Lie Detector Tests are widely used in Law Enforcement. Particularly early on in cases when people are trying to decide whether a witness is telling the truth. Also, widely used in the Justice Department as an employment device. So the introduction of this Lie Detector Test not as evidence, but as an indication that ms. Daniels is being truthful at least in so far as her story about having intercourse with the president is very compelling here. And matt miller, when you were serving the obama administration, i dont recall him making a joinder motion for any lawsuits like this. No. We never dealt with anything like this. Look, i think mr. Avenatti is pursuing this case the way you would expect for somebody in his position. He is being very aggressive both in court and with media strategy. What is surprising is how you see the president responding. If Stormy Daniels were to come out and just Start Talking and explain that she had a consensual affair with donald trump, i dont think that would surprise anyone. Im not even sure it would hurt the president very much. But when you see the president pursuing this strategy to silence her in court, something weve not seen from previous presents, something that is completely inappropriate for the occupant of the oval office to do to a private citizen. Let me ask you about that, matt, and then i want to go back to michael. Youre putting your finger on the fact that for a long time it was said that donald trump would fight everyone in public but Vladimir Putin. And there were inferences that some drew from that. It seems that now here in the second year of the presidency, he will have a public fight with everyone but Vladimir Putin and Stormy Daniels. Yeah. And the question you have to ask, is he worried about something damaging in this case in particular . Maybe. Maybe not. Or is he worried about the precedent it might set if there are other nondisclosure agreements that he sign order that Michael Cohen signed on his behalf, in a strange arrangement where Michael Cohen was a party and maybe the president was or wasnt. Are they worried about setting a precedent here that if they let this one go by without a fight that it opens the doors to other people coming forward and talking . I dont think we know the answer to that yet. But that would be one way to explain the president s very aggressive, very unusual posture. Ari, im used to im used to playing chess. Okay, in my cases. And ive had the good fortune to go up against some really good chess players from around this country. Is Michael Cohen playing chess with you . Well, let me just say this. Really good chess players. Lawyers at the top of their game. Really good lawyers that are really good chess players. And i like to count myself as a pretty good chess player. Right now were playing three dimensional chess, and these guys are playing tic tac toe, quite honestly. And theyre not even playing tic tac toe that well. When we filed this case, there was one response that made sense, and one response only. And that response should have been you know what . Youre right. I was a party to the agreement. This is the president speaking. She is free to talk. She can tell her story and im going to tell mine. Guess what . Had that happened, i wouldnt be sitting here right now and we wouldnt be talking about it. That is not what has happened. They have stepped into every trap weve laid in this case the last two weeks. Its remarkable. Ive never seen anything like it. Ive never had any good fortune like this. Were going to keep shooting until we miss. And the problem, ari, is now theyre doubling and tripling down. Now we have the president of the United States, and i think its important to take a step back and think about this for a minute. We have a sitting u. S. President who is carrying out a vendetta against a woman who alleges that she had an affair with him and suing her for 20 million. Yeah. And is attempting to continue to silence her and put her under his thumb. Thats what this is about. I think thats a significant part. And look, we have covered the story, and weve covered it especially assertively since friday. For everyone who says well, here is this Stormy Daniels story over here, why should it be about the president . No. Starting friday, the president inserted himself and is literally seeking to bankrupt a private citizen for their words. That is clearly important. I want to read for the benefit of response, Michael Cohen addressing when you were questioned about whether your client faced threats of physical harm and you said yes. Michael cohens new response ive never spoken to her, ive never emailed her, ive never texted her. Every interaction with her was through a previous attorney. I reiterate, ive never threatened her in any way, and im unaware of anyone else doing so. Your response. And the agreement was drafted without the knowledge of donald trump and mr. Cohen made the payment and no one else ever knew about it. Do you have reason to believe that specific denial is misleading . Jeff. And i think do you have evidence that Michael Cohen would know about the physical threats allegation you have made . Im not going to answer the question as to what we have and what we dont have. But here is what i will say. People shoo be very careful about representations they make, unequivocal reputations they make. Joyce, your thoughts on any of the above . It sounds like there is a little bit more evidence that mr. Avenatti has that well all learn about in the future. There has been at least some indication that there is additional evidence, that there are documents. I think he said that. And of course the nondisclosure agreement represents a whole host of potential pieces of evidence. Text messages, other information about former sexual partners. So i think a lot of folks will be looking forward to listening into the 60 minutes episode if it airs. But at the end of the day, we got to remember that what we have going on here is really a credibility matchup between the president s lawyer and a porn star. And that is a phenomenal place for this country to be at this particular point in time. And the president is in a real box because hes denied knowing her. He has denied knowing that they ever had any type of an affair. For him to walk that back to the point where he could let her tell her story and he could tell his i think is a very difficult path for him to walk. Right. And he may have really put himself in a box he cant get out of here. And on that point, matt miller, your final word on us. Ill hand the mic here to Stormy Daniels who wrote today, technically, i didnt sleep with potus 12 years ago. There was no sleeping. He was a goofty reality tv star. But i digress. People do care that he lied about it, had me bullied, broke laws to visit covered up. Ps, im not going anywhere, xoxoxo. Its tawdry. Its trashy. But what do people expect . This this is what happens when you elect a reality star president , someone who has for years operate kind of in the tabloid world, in the trashiest ends of the legal world and of the media world. This is the kind of thing you get with donald trump as president. And i dont think that Stormy Daniels or the other two women who have filed or are attempting to file suit against him, i dont think these are the last of these cases were going to see. Matt miller, joyce vance, and the lawyer michael avenatti, thanks to each of you for joining me tonight. Coming up, there is breaking news President Trump was specifically warned dont congratulate putin, be he chose to do that over advice from his own National Security adviser. Also tonight, reports steve bannon was supervising the misuse of data from facebook two years before the Trump Campaign. All of that coming up. And weve been following of course as i mentioned the serious breaking news out of austin, texas tonight. I want to mention again for our viewers, keeping an eye on this important story, we are still awaiting this Law Enforcement News Conference. They were called about an incident at a Goodwill Store. A reported explosion a short time ago. We can tell you police says it does not appear that that new report, however concerning it is, is at this time connected to the string of bombings. One Person Injured after investigating, Austin Police also tweeting this out. Quote, there was no package explosion in the 9800 block of brodie lane. Items inside the package were not a bomb rather an incendiary device. Well update you when we get it. More of the last word after this break. Guy got a flat tire in the middle of the night. Hold on dad. Liberty did what . Yeah, Liberty Mutual 24hour roadside assistance helped him to fix his flat so he could get home safely. My dad says ou