To lead the cray doesnt matter. He is dying anyway. There was strong rejection of Kelly Saddlers compensates but not a single word from donald trump or the Trump White House. In a normal white house mocking a veteran over a cancer diagnosis piet get you fired at the very least there would be a public apology. But the Trump White House is not a normal would you say. So instead we got this. Does the white house not think you need to condemn the remarks. Im not going to validate a leak one way or the other out of an internal staff meeting. Are you saying she didnt say it. Im not validating a leak out of an internal staff meeting one way or another. Why not apologize to mccain. Im not getting into a back and forth people want to create issues of leaked staff meeting. Does kelly stadleer work at the white house. She does yes. More broadly does the president set the tone . Does he pare responsibility for the tone set here at the white house and all of the of aers working here frankly certainly does he has done a good job of laying out the priorities of the administration. So the Trump White House isnt denying the widely reported comments. And its not apologizing. Instead its aching the leak of the story to the media. Former Vice President joe biden had one of the strongest reactions. He released this statement. Quote people wondered when decency would hit rock bottom with this administration. It happened yesterday. Given the white house trail of disrespect toward johnen a others this staffer is not the exception to have rule. Megan mccain fired back at the statements this morning on the view. Kelly here is a little news flash this may be intense for 11 00 in the morning on a friday. But were all dying. Im dying. Youre dying were all dying. Yeah. And i want to say that since my dad has been diagnosed the past almost a year july 19th, i really feel like i understand the meaning of life. And it is not how how you die its how you live. Right. [ applause ] sflo and whatever you want to say in this kind of environment, the thing that surprises me most is i was talking about this with you joy, i dont understand what kind of environment you are working in when that would be acceptable and then you can come to work the next day and still have a job. Well apparently its an environment set by donald trump. Its no secret that donald trump and john mccain have a history of conflict. Donald trump said that john mccain, a man spending five years as a prisoner of war in vietnam where he was tor tort yurded regularly is not a war hero. The president who got five deferments from vietnam hasnt apologized. John mcmahon has stood up to donald trump more than any other republican. He turned over the Infamous Trump dossier to the fbi. A decision he describes in the upcoming book saying i did what duty demanded i do. Last summer john mccain cast the deciding vote to defendant the repeal the obamacare. Donald trump hasnt forthen about that. Except for one senator who came into a room at 3 00 in the morning and went like that we would have had health care two. We would have had health care two thing of that. Steve schmidt whom you see a lot on this new york. Ran senator john mccain 2008 president ial campaign and knows the senator well. Today on msnbc he describes what he sees as the difference between john mccain and donald trump. Megan mccain had it kmkt right. Its how you live your life opinion. And Kelly Saddler and all thepeople in that white house that are tearing down our institutions pitting american against american, theyre exactly the opposite of john mccain. He is the type of man that i would aspire and i think any parent in this country would aspire for their son to be like. And i dont think there is a lot of parents out in this country today who are saying i want my kid growing up like donald trump. One thing i know for sure there will never be a person on television, not now and not for a thousand ians that ever says what i just said about john mccain of donald trump. That he is a great man. He is a small and vial man and thats the difference between the two men. Joining us now Jonathan Alder msnbc plik willing analyst and columnist for dale beast. Malcom vance who taut members of the navy and marines how to survive this captured also mailboxes nbc counterterrorism and intelligence analyst. Susan, a republican strategist welcome to all three of you thank you for being here. Malcom i start with you because i started with you this morning when this was fresher news. And i had people tweeting me saying i havent seen malcom that angry. Last time you saw me angry was somebody insulting the kazir chan. Im an navy chief. I have long career and i come from a very, very old military family. Every father and son from the civil war until today. Wow. Including my niece just in combat off of yemen. Im a chief. My job as a chief is to make sure when i see something wrong that its recalibrated. Thats the phrase we use. I will not stand i wont have it for what i heard about john mccain. Ive met john campaign. I have taut students about his captivity. I said his did he brief when he came out of hand noy. I melt dpirl stack dale would come to our school and talk about being in the hand noy hilton. Doug heg dahl our adviser said this man served with honor. And to have them smear him, to come and actually use people who didnt serve people who think its a joke that he is dying, there will be buildings name after john mccain. Monuments after john mccain. But there wont be for any of these people and perhaps not even donald trump. Susan, Steve Schmidt also tweeted today he has been vocal about this. Of course. People who dont know john mccain about this are vocal. But say why have no republican as fors stepped forward and expressed outrage about this by a white house staffer its despicable is cowardis is nauseate zblag people dont have to say. John mccain engaged in debates with people willingly. I debated him others have. But his honor is not to be questioned. And the idea that you say that john mccain doesnt matter. Lets and what kind of spurred this on was john mccain saying he had a policy difference. Right. And did not want to support the current nominee for cia director. He is entitled to. He backed it up it wasnt personal at all he made a point of it exactly right. What i find amazing is how Kelly Saddler still has a jb. And i dont think it should have made its way up to the president. She is a midlevel staffer. General kelly should have called her in dismissed her. If he didnt this morning she should have caulked walked in and handed in the resignation. She is becoming on top of all of ignorance and poor judgment she is becoming a problem for this administration. So she should have been gone. But you know, donald trump said he was going to hire the best out there. This is what he considers the best . This is a disgrace. Jonathan, to use malcoms word recalibrate. I dont know if this rierz a resignation. It may have dealt with a recalibration. Were in the place where they are not acknowledging it was said. Unforced error you could could have gotten away with apology theyre not defying it. If theyre not defying then they need to issue this white house defies a lot of things. That often turn out to be true. Because they know the defile is not convincing and too many witnesses. The thing you have to understand is that this white house has elevated and validated shamelessness. And it started during the campaign when donald trump said i like people who werent captured. Right. And basically really dised john mccain. John mccain did not respond and trump got away with it. At a time when people thought he would at least take a big hit in the polls. He didnt suffer at all. The republican electorate didnt care. So that then emboldened the shamelessness. He realized he could attack mccain the despite his being a war hero and because of that worked he could attack him despite him dying of cancer. There is no point at which this man will have any shred of decency or convy a shred of decency in the white house. The fish rots from the head. Everybody in that white house takes their cues the way they treat people in the disrespect with which they treat people from the president of the United States. Susan, its interesting, because it won be a nice thing to say about anybody. Doesnt matter because theyre dying. Its uniquely unusual because of the disrespect the president has shone john campaign. Nicole wallace points out that what a lot of republicans have learned that john mccain can be a torn in peoples side. He stands on his principles. Its not a wing strategy. But donald trump has never followed that rule. He picks fights with john mccain a lot. He does. And again, i think jonathan was right. He doesnt suffer for it. I mean donald trump he sided with White Supremacists for crying out loud and didnt take a hit for it. And john mccain he will have his dignity. I would say that donald trump wouldnt have any but i dont think he or he lost it but i dont think he ever had it. And for him not to for him to continually go after senator mccain, especially knowing he was sick. Its not the first time he did it. Not the first time the white house did it. He has done it ever since. Megan skmaen called him out and he said ill hold back. But this is just, again, its gone too far. There is a danger to normizing this. It is. Right . We have it all served in the military. We generally think its something we respect. But people say over time we dont have the respect for it where is go on a long time you see the names of the fallen published in the newspaper from time to time. This really normalizes disrespect for the few things you shouldnt disrespect it does. It absolutely normalizes disrespect. You know, to the points they both made, there is a reason that were seeing this mob up attitude from Sarah Huckabee sanders talking about this is an internal meeting were not talking about leaks. The leak is not the biggest problem. Its a problem but. No its not a problem at all. Its a cover for what theyre doing. These are people thinking theyre playing the restaurant scene in good fellows with joe peshy and everybody and theyre the gang sitting around the table can do what they want and say what they want, insult who they want and public ritual humiliatation or using congress or allies to do that is the way they do it. This is the bottom line. They cannot cross this line again. If there is a military person in that building, especially you know all the meals are serve by navy chiefs. Let me tell you if i had been in that room or near that room i would have called a dressing down, one way conversation straight to their face. I dont care who else is in there. Because this line of honor look the building has been desecrated by these people. All right. For them to go after the honor of a man not just a dying inventory he is a real hero. Read what he did from a fivetime draft dodger. Im sorry i won have any of it. Jonathan, there are things of this administration would like us to follow up on and like to report and donald trump endlessly tweets we dont report on things. Its not true i think we report on everything. But these are the kind of things that take up the headlines because they do it to themselves and it goes to character. You know, i spent a lot of time with john mccain in 2000. And he day after day those of us on what they call the Straight Talk press, a small group of reporters it was really honestly the most fun ive had covering politics not just because he was hugely entertaining and he did take shots at people. Sure he does. But there was a sense of character and decency. This is a guy who got together when one of his big critics from the vietnam war and antiwar activist broadcasting against him from hanoi john mccain went to his bedside, held his hand, reconciled him just the opposite of what donald trump is doing now. If donald trump had a shred of character he would say, you know, john mccain and i weve had our innings, been on opposite sides of issues. I got upset with him over health care. But this is a great american. It would help trump politically to do that. But he is constitutionally in terms of his constitution incapable incapable because he is a person of poor character up against a person of fine character. And if you dont respect the white house like he doesnt respect that oval office how do you expect everyone else around you to show that same respect when the president doesnt . You know, john kasich tonight had compensates on this lets listen for a second. The compensates by a white house staffer in regard to john mccain were just outrageous, totally out of line. And frankly i think its incumbent on the white house to apologize not just for the staffer but for all the administration because john mccain is an american hero. And we need to recognize. He served his country well and paid a very high price. Susan, john kasich is not running any time soon he is a man of character im not surprised. Why is it to Steve Schmidts earlier point why is it difficult for republican senators to come out and be clear these are the colleagues. The only ones speaking up are those going out the. Reporter jeff flake commented today. There are a few. But theyre out the door. I as a republican am so frustrated because i want people to fight for Republican Values thats how they ran. Correct. Theyre not standing up to the president because of politics. Thats not which youre there. Be bold. Right. Lose an election. But do the right thing. And theyre not. And thats whats really when people say whats happening to the Republican Party . We dont have leaders any more. Because losing support for the doctor of the military for republicans is just that doesnt make any zbleens but you know, the military is not a praetorian guard. They do not protect the emperor. I have put my life on the line for every person in this country. Republican be democrat, independent i dont care. You a right to free speech and say what you want. But to sit in that room, either in the executive Office Building or the white house and to make a joke about that, right there, she should have either been as you said like fired on the spot i would have if anybody was of senior rank they shall have said im sorry you cant work in this building, a building with washington, lincoln all of the honors heroes, honored heroes who didnt avoid their duty to the country in war. But she is still there. And if she is there tomorrow this is going to remain a subject. Its the republican members of congress that i cant get over. They look so weak and kraven by keggi this position. They think theyre losing votes if they say this was wrong to say this about a dying man . They really think that . They are failing a character test of their own. Thank you to all of you jonathan, malcom, susan. As team trump are in damage control. Rudy giuliani lose his cool over avenatti and avenatti tweets another bread crumb about quo and financial dealing. And donald trump isnt going to like what was said about him in the Mueller Investigation. We do whatever it takes to fight cancer. These are the specialists were proud to call our own. Experts from all over the world, working closely together to deliver truly personalized cancer care. Expert medicine works here. Learn more at cancercenter. Com to bring together a group of remarkable people. To help save the universe. From paying too much on their car insurance. Hey, theres cake in the breakroom. What are you doing . Um. Nothing . Marvel studios avengers infinity war, in theaters april 27th. Now. Where were we . Rudy giuliani is escalating his war of word with Michael Avenatti, the lawyer for Stormy Daniels. This week avenatti challenged the new lawyer to a teebt tweeting quote it would be helpful for the public to witness a discussion between mr. Giuliani and me. After several days of near silence from giuliani he is going on the attack. During a phone call with business increaser giuliani said he wouldnt debate Michael Avenatti because avenatti is pitchering for money. Thats what he said i dont get involved with pitchers. The media gives him room because he makes round about charges and get had him nothing. I think he is getting in serious trouble. He goes on to tell business increaser that it wouldnt be fair i debate intelligent skilled people. Pointing ha alan derch wints. I know alan dershowitz. Knows alan dershowitz. It comes hours after avenatti tweeted this warning. Let this serve as formal notice there is more evidence and facts to come relating to mr. Cohens dealings and mr. Trumps knowledge and involvement. Can you come clean now or wait to be outed. Your choice. We have only just begun. Well some of that information may already be coming to light. The wall street journal reports that Michael Cohen made of an overtour to provide services to Ford Motor Company in january of 2017 but was quickly rebuffed. The journal reports that special Counsel Robert Mueller has taken an interest in cohens pretty much. Mr. Muellers team has requested information from ford about the outreach including emails and records and has interviewed fords head of government affairs. People familiar with the mattered said. And the daily beast is reporting that at t met with another group of the president s allies around the time it hired Michael Cohen. The company spoke with the Washington Lobbying Firm avenue strategies in early 2017 which was cofounded and staffed by Trump Campaign veterans and marketed its insight into and favor with the Trump White House. At t confirmed on friday. Ave was off the top of my headed bid Corey Lewandowski and Barry Bennett a Senior Adviser on the campaign. One source familiar says the they discussed a political appropriating that would not entail official lobbies and cost the company in the range of 40,000 per month. But no agreement was ever reached. Joining us now is jill wine banks, form former assist watergate prosecutor and back with us is jonathan alter. Jill, lets start with you