Hearing . Also, the president went on his Favorite Network today and a fox news host tried harder than usual to challenge him. It didnt go over well. More on those stories later in the hour. But we begin tonight with the latest impeachment developments. In a new interview with the l. A. Times, House Intelligence Committee chairman adam schiff says that his committee has begun writing his report in the impeachment investigation against President Trump. And once the report is written, itll be handed off to the Judiciary Committee which will draft the actual articles of impeachment. But schiff hasnt ruled out hearing from more witnesses before he submits the report. Quote, were not foreclosing the possibility of additional depositions or hearings, but were also not willing to wait months and months and let them play ropeadope with us in the courts. Schiff said the committee will work both tracks on continuing to investigate while beginning to put our report together. Democrats seem to have learned all they need to from the impeachment hearings, but the same cannot be said for the president who continues to push the unsubstantiated claim that ukraine worked against him in the 2016 election. We should warn you what you are about to hear is not accurate. The fbi went in and they told him get out of here, were not giving it to you. They gave the server to crowd strike or whatever its called, which is a Company Owned by a very wealthy ukrainian. And i still want to see that server. You know, the fbi has never gotten that server. Thats a big part of this whole thing. Why did they give it to a Ukrainian Company . Are you sure they did that . Are you sure they gave it to ukraine . Well, thats what the word is. Thats not actually what the word is. I sort of feel for those guys on fox friends. Allow if you will to step back and fact check this. Quote, they gave the server to crowd strike or whatever its called. Wrong. Which is a Company Owned by a very wealthy ukrainian. Wrong. The fbi has never gotten that server. Wrong. Trump cant even seem to get his own Conspiracy Theory right. Trump went onto tell fox news, quote, ukraine hated me. They were after me in the election. They wanted Hillary Clinton to win. Lets be clear on this point, too. The Intelligence Community concluded that russia russia interfered in the 2016 election. All of this is to say that the president must not have been watching the impeachment hearings too closely this week because his comments came just a day after this woman, fiona hill, the former National SecurityCouncil Senior director for europe and russia chastised republicans for pushing this, quote, fictional narrative. Some of you on this committee appear to believe that russia and its Security Services did not conduct a campaign against our country and that perhaps somehow for some reason ukraine did. This is fictional narrative that has been perpetrated and propagated by the russian Security Services themselves. Fiona hill has no other dog in this fight. When she says its a fictional narrative, this comes from a lot of experience. Tonight the New York Times reports that fiona hills testimony aligned closely with recent Intelligence Briefings given to United States senators. Quote, american intelligence officials informed senators and their aides in recent weeks that russia had engaged in a yearslong campaign to essentially frame ukraine as responsible for moscows own hacking of the 2016 election, according to three american officials. The revelations demonstrate russias persistence in trying to sow discord among its adversaries and show that the kremlin apparently succeeded, as unfounded claims about ukrainian interference seeped into republican talking points, end quote. If that is not evidence enough that trump is pushing a Conspiracy Theory, try this. Vladimir putin himself says hes pleased that the, quote, political battles in washington have put on the back burner accusations that russia interfered in u. S. Elections. According to the Associated Press putin said this week, quote, thank god no one is accusing us of interfering in the u. S. Elections anymore. Now theyre accusing ukraine. Leading off our discussion tonight daily beast editor at large. Hes currently writing a book on Russian Military intelligence. David corn, an msnbc political analyst. He attended all three days of the impeachment hearings this week. Gentlemen, we had a fairly robust conversation before the show started on the idea that there are people, you might even call them reasonable people, educated people, smart people who continue to believe this bunk that fiona hill told congress, and she is as senior and learned as you get on this, its not true. It is a fiction. It is perpetrated by russia to have people believe that somehow ukraine, which is in a war with russia, in dispute with russia was the one involved in hacking the election or interfering in the u. S. Election. What more, michael, can you say to people who continue to believe this or perpetrate this . There are several different strands to this Conspiracy Theory. The most i hesitate to use the word legitimate, but the most kind of credible one the then Ukrainian Ambassador to the United States wrote an oped castigating donald trump for comments he made which are rather bizarre and also contradictory. Number one donald trump, then candidate trump said most crimeans want to be part of russia just legitimizing and also donald trump i believe in conversation with George Stephanopoulos if im president russia will never invade crimea even after they had done, so this was his way to get back at barack obama. Charlies oped i think published it was done publicly it is actually based on my own reporting some of the least incendiary red rihetoric used by diplomats by then candidate trump given some of the comments he made not just about ukraine but also about nato and i recall being in a european country and meeting with foreign minister of a nato member state in which donald trump came on the television and that foreign minister told me, if this candidate is elected, its the end of the west. So the point here is somebody criticized donald trump who was then a candidate which donald trump and others have then turned into the fact there was an attempt to interfere in the election. Yeah, and he did it openly. Thats the key thing. The russian attack as bob mueller characterized it was systematic and sweeping. It involved illegal activity, stealing emails, releasing them and taking over parts this was the oped. This was an oped. We have just now all three of us fallen into the trap. Were discussing it and were trying to explain whats there and isnt there and getting into details. When donald trump and i sat through this all week, jim jordan, devin nunes and the republicans on the panel and others, all they do is try to string together in a very word salad nefarious way terms and names. Steele, ukraine, meddling, opeds, tweets, money and they try to create an impression however, unfortunately its something you cant get away from because its in the mainstream now. Because the president himself is doing this. And they are just trying to create this alternative reality for people who dont want to believe the worst of donald trump, who want to believe in donald trump and they need Something Else to hang onto. And thats what theyre giving them. In the leadup to the brexit referendum in the u. K. , barack obama who was then visiting the u. K. Wrote an oped in the telegraph basically saying, guys, dont do this. Also ill advised as the american president to get involved in somebodys internal politics. However, is that the same thing as two different russian intelligence organizations conducting Cyber Espionage against a Political Party in a foreign country, then leaking the contents of their correspondence to a russian asset, in this case wikileaks, for the purposes of bolstering one candidate and diminishing the other. Is that also tantamount to running a sophisticated active measures campaign in the form of disinformation and propaganda using social media. Lets assume everything you two have just said, we take it at face value, these are different things. What this diplomat did is not the same as interference in a u. S. Election. I want to play why this is dangerous. You say wisely we fall into a trap when we discuss this. As journalists, sometimes we have to go down some of these roads. Yes. Heres where the real danger lies as articulated by fiona hill. Right now russias Security Services and their proxies have geared up to repeat their interference in the 2020 election. We are running out of time to stop them. In the course of this investigation i would ask you please not promote politically driven falsehoods that so clearly advance russian interests. Thats the rub. Therein lies the rub. As long as everybodys discussing this, Vladimir Putin has said this is fantastic. Oh, its great. And what it does is trump has never fully acknowledged that the russians attacked and that the russians attacked to help him and that the russian attack had an impact on the campaign. He cant live with that. Its a taint on his presidency. And because of that hes not been able to in the last three years as president to deal with the prospect of another russian attack. In fact, the Washington Post reported a few weeks ago that when he met i think in may of 2017 with two russian officials in the oval office he told them he was not concerned. And so what hes been trying to do for the last three years is to remove this stain, create alternative narratives. And what it does is leave the United States wide open to another attack because he cant accept the first one. And we go fast forward to the ukraine scandal which is all about what . Again, trying to do something to rig the 2020 election in his favor. So the gear we should be on here, the other line of defense republicans are using is that nobody who testified was really in the room or on the call. Which is not true because there were people there and fact witnesses and people like fiona hill who have context and are fact witnesses. But the bottom line is the people who could probably tell us the most about this did not appear to testify. Adam schiff tells Los Angeles Times that weve made it abundantly clear to the president that their failure to permit witnesses to testify and failure to respond to any of our subpoenas has only built the case against them for obstruction of congress. The fact is mulvaney, giuliani, bolton, these people can tell you whether the president told them to do something. The president and others have made it clear hes willing to throw them under the bus. So we dont know what theyre going to do. Gordon sondland responded to being thrown under the bus or threatened by throwing somebody else back. The other side of this this is assuming mr. Giuliani and mr. Bolton would tell the truth in the case of mr. Giuliani however, the idea this is democratic coup or witch hunt this is the most preposterous statement of them all. The call is coming from inside the house as they say in horror films. The people going to impeach this president are republicans. Gordon sondland, not exactly anybodys idea of the diplomats diplomat, a partisan hack, if i may. Somebody who gave a lot of money to the rnc and trump campaign. Got a position he probably didnt deserve. Comes before congress and says there was a quid pro quo. Hes a republican operative. Kurt volker, arguably tried to finesse and manage a very difficult situation. Didnt exactly cover himself in glory, has also delivered a verdict that, yes, there was something very dodgey going on here. John bolton in a record to the press i dont want any part of this drug deal. John bolton, nobodys idea of a progressive liberal democratic operative. Republicans are the ones coming forward and basically providing the noose of which this president is going to hang himself. The Devin Nunes Jim jordan line this whole thing is political conspiracy, its nonsense. Its nonsense on stilts. Ive known fiona hill for several years. Ive followed her work for a very long time. This is one of the most professional scholarly russia analysts there is. By the way, shes described often in the u. S. News cycle as a kremlin hawk. Not exactly. Very nuanced in her appraisal. Her biography, which is one of the more insightful biographies of Vladimir Putin, very cleverly its almost a postmodern analysis. She takes different archetypes of who putin and is studies them. She takes them in isolation and then creates a composite. Not just the kgb case officer but the capitalists and statist and so on. This is not someone who gets ahead of her skis with allegations. Unfortunately were out of time for this discussion but i love having it with you both. Thank you both for being with us. Coming up, lev and igor have made it into the impeachment investigation, and now levs lawyer says lev has evidence relevant to the investigation about devin nunes, the minority chairman of the House Intelligence Committee. That is next. Great riches will find you when Liberty Mutual customizes your car insurance, so you only pay for what you need. Wow. Thanks, zoltar. How can i ever repay you . Maybe you could free zoltar . Thanks, lady. Taxi only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Fred would do anything for his daughter even being the back half of a unicorn. Fortunately, the front half washed his shirt with gain. Ahhhhhhh. The irresistible scent of gain. The indicted ukrainian associate of Rudy Giuliani says he has, quote, hard evidence of Donald Trumps misconduct in the plot to bribe ukraine. Joseph bondi is a lawyer for lev parnas. He tweeted, quote, he has material firsthand evidence that is in our National Interest to hear. Part of that evidence were learning also pertains to the Top Republican on the House Intelligence Committee, this man, devin nunes. Another of parnas lawyer ed mcmahn told the daily beast this week that parnas, quote, helped arrange meetings and calls in europe for representative devin nunes in 2018. Nunes aide harvey participated in the meetings which were arranged to help nunes investigative work. Mcmahn didnt testify what those investigations entailed, end quote. Betsy Woodruff Swan is still working on the story. Shes an editor for the daily beast and an msnbc contributor. Also barbara mcquaid, former u. S. Attorney for the Eastern District of michigan and an msnbc legal contributor. Betsy, what is this new information about lev parnas . I can tell you that i spoke with bondy, the lawyer you referred to earlier this evening. He told me two things that are new for me to have confirmed. The first thing that he said was that an aide to congressman nunes told Lev Parnas Nunes and team were investigated the biden family and an Energy Company called burisma where joe bidens son hunter biden was a board member. Those topics were of paramount importance to trump and giuliani. Trump and giuliani pressured the Ukrainian Government to investigate those specific topics in hopes that an investigation would benefit trump. And the second thing he told me is that a former ukrainian prosecutor named victor shulkin, an important character, told lev parnas he had a meeting with congressman nunes in vienna. Victor shulkin is a vital character in this story. He was a prosecutor in ukraine, widely accused of corruption who biden and other western leaders basically pushed out. Biden and other european leaders told the Ukrainian Government they wouldnt get a Financial Aid package unless shulkin was ousted. Shulkin now has claimed that the reason he was ousted was because he was scrutinizing burisma and biden forced him out as part of a quid pro quo. The evidence belies those allegations, but that allegation is something that President Trump appears to have bought hook, line and sinker. And it was part of what he was pressuring the Zelensky Administration to announce that they were scrutinizing back on that july 25th phone call. Barbara, as you know we study these things as journalists and people like betsey report on them. But the little we know about the law leads one to think that devin nunes was front and center in all these hearings. He was in the socalled secret hearings, the behind closed door hearings that republicans accused democrats of not letting republicans into even though devin nunes was in all of them. Eric swalwell, who is on the intelligence committee, entered betsys reporting about devin nunes into the record and said this. Mr. Chairman, youve been falsely accused throughout these proceedings by the Ranking Member as being quoteunquote a fact witness. Now if this story is correct the Ranking Member may have actually been projecting. And in fact he may be the fact witness if hes working with indicted individuals around our