1960. Rose we continue about Foreign Policy with ian bremmer and a conversation about russia. Here is the problem is the shortterm is longer than almost any american i notice. There are a lot of Wishful Thinking that so far you put all of these standings against him, at least ten different sanctions in place against escalation for his misbehavior and miss dealings in the ukraine and his willingness to back down has been precisely zero. His Approval Ratings have stayed in the eighties, up 88 percent in october at one point and still in the mid eighties, there is a large demand in russia for someone to stand up and tell the west thats it. Rose we conclude this evening with Harry Shearer and his production nixons the one. He is the most interesting as a character person to have high office in this country at least in our lifetimes. Rose because . You know, they say that the gri a city of a personality can be detected in the number of the folds inform the cerebrum. Rose and he has the most folds. The most folds. Rose cuba, russia and a Harry Shearer when we continue. Funding for charlie rose is provided by the following. Additional funding provided by and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and Information Services worldwide. From our studios in new york city, this captioning sponsored by Rose Communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. Rose we begin this evening with a dramatic a announcement by the president at noon today that the United States will begin to form lies diplomatic relations with cuba and open an embassy in havana for the first time in more than half century. Todays announcement marks the most significant change in the u. S. Cuba relationship since the cuba revolution, the news come after the release of American Contractor alan gross who was held in a cuban prison for five years, cuba also released unnamed u. S. Intelligence agent who has been in prison for 20 years in exchange for the final three members of the spy ring known as the cuban 5. The deal was negotiated during 18 months of secret talks between the u. S. And cuba hosted in canada and at the vatican. President obama and raul castro spoke by phone yesterday for more than 45 minutes. It was the first substantive president ial level discussion between the u. S. And cuba since 1961. President obama announced the new policy earlier today. Today the United States of america is changing its relationship with the people of cuba. In the most significant changes in our policy in more than 50 years. We will end an outdated approach that for decades has failed to advance our interests and instead we will begin to form lies relations between our two countries. Through these changes we intend to create more opportunities for the american and cuban people and begin a new chapter among the nations of the americas. Over many months by administration has held discussions with the cuban government about alans case, and other aspects of our relationship. Pope francis issued a personal appeal to me and to cubas president raul castro urging us to resolve alans case, and to address cubas interest from in the release of three cuban agents who have been jailed in the United States for over 15 years. I have been instructed secretary kerry to immediately begin discussions with cuba to reestablish diplomatic relations that have been severed since january of 1961. Going forward the United States will reestablish an embassy in havana and high ranking officials will visit cuba. Where we can advance shared interests we will on issues like health, migration, counterterrorism, Drug Trafficking and disaster response. These are the steps that i can take as president to change this policy. The embargo that has been imposed for decades is now codified in legislation. These changes unfold i look forward to Engaging Congress in an honest and serious debate about lifting the embargo. Rose joining me now to talk about this historic breakthrough in cuban u. S. Relationships are julia cooke, author of the other side of paradise, life in the new cuba and Ernesto Londono of the New York Times editorial board. The paper has been urging the restoration of full diplomatic relations with cuba in a series of editorials i am pleased to have both of them here. I promised i would say the following things and you can help me with this. What the president has said we want to establish full diplomatic relations and have an embassy there. But this is a process and he said to the secretary of state, start now. And build on this. There are some difficulties, there are some varying views but this is a huge step forward, president pointed out that congress has a role in this because of the embargo will have to come or the end of the embargo from congress. But having said all of that, and whatever differences there might be, react to this. Tell me what you, your assessment of this is. Charlie i think the white house had two options, they could have taken a gradual approach and baby steps and measures to see if this could gain some traction, or they could have gone big and they chose to go big. What they did was they essentially went as far and as big as they possibly can within the constraints of a draconian 1996 law that could affect the embargo. What they hope is one these new changes against off the ground and start being implemented it becomes easier for measures and cuban americans to travel to cuba, for americans to help cubas new private sector, that the reality of the transformational nature of these changes will inform the broader debate, the debate that will ultimately have to land in congress. Rose what is that debate over the future of the embargo . 02 over the future of what the legislative approach needs to be toward cuba. There has been in recent month a growing number of lawmakers that have seen the merits of engagement with cuba, cuba is a difficult country to engage in, there are still human rights record and there is still a reality on the island that it should and does give american lawmakers and american policy makers great concern. The question is whether we stand to influence the reality there through punitive measures as we tried unsuccessfully for five decades or whether engagement and particular engagement alongside other governments in the western hemisphere stand to be a better approach. We have argued that it does. Rose julie . To me the greatest revelation of the day was that raul castro said in his speech to the cuban people, because he gave a speech concurrently to obamas, that obamas decision deserves the respect of the cuban people. That is such a dramatic departure from what the cuban government has told its people about the United States since 1960. I wrote a book not about the politics of cuba but about the people in havana. So my interviews were much more based on peoples daily lives and experiences and the way they interpret the government and the people and the way that their daily lives are impacted by these large policy roles. Rose what is interesting is watching is, number one, that the president constantly referred to the cuban people, he didnt talk about the government, he talked about the cuban people and this was addressed to them. The second is he has a 45 minute phone conversation last night with raul castro. What was that about . What did they say . I think in the history of cuban American Relations there has been a very long history of back channel talks of secret negotiations that through the years sought to get to this moment, get to a moment where the president s could agree to chart out a new path forward. Historically, though, there was always something that derailed those. Sometimes it was politics, sometimes there was somebody playing a spoiler role. In this case after 18 months, this got to a level where the two president s could get on the phone and in essence sign the dotted line and make a deal and that is really, really important. Rose so the human side, that you did a series and your book was about the cuban people. Is this something they desperately wanted . Oh, definitely. Rose because of their own economic condition or because they just want to be have a Free Exchange with the United States . Both, definitely economics has everything to do with it but it is as matter of respect. The idea of being recognized as a sovereign nation that requires neither to be colonized by the United States nor vilified is huge. Rose . I also think it i it is realy interesting, the president received some criticism because he wasnt bold enough. I mean this was clearly bold. He was looking to do something bold. He chose boldness. This was as far as i thinke could have gone, you know, without running into what is codified in law. Rose yes. And are you surprised to a bit that it happened while fidel castro was still alive because his brother had begun to be different than he was. Sure. Rose and as you suggested when you sat down there is a new Vice President who represents the heir apparents situate. Fidel castro has really disappeared largely from view in cuba. Sometimes he still you know, there are columns published under his by lane with some remarks, but he is no longer running the show as far as i can tell. If you see what happened politically on the island since raul castro took the reins in 2008 there have been some notable changes, a gradual and limited liberalization of the economy that has had transformational changes for hundreds of thousands of people who had the chance to Start Building hives that are not wholly subject to state control, and that is hugely important, it has changed peoples outlooks and change peoples mentalities and the dna of the economy there and i think it is planted the steeds of hope for what can be a healthy and prosperous economy going forward. Also, last year, the government started lifting restrictions on cubans that wanted to travel abroad, this allowed dissidents to travel for the first time and to start having exposure to cuban american diaspora, to cuban american lawmakers. This, i think, also represented a sea change and the cubans, i think, have made some of these decisions with an eye to favoring way for United States to form lies relations. I think these were deliberate stems and these were steps that from their Vantage Point werent risk free and were very much an investment in getting to this point. Rose there is still some people who, senator from florida, rubio, chairman, former chairman of the senator Foreign Relations committee, menendez from new jersey are voicing objections to this. What are the political ramifications do you think in terms of american politics . You know, i am not a politics expert. What i am most interested in is the fact that the reactions to this, while rubio is predictable in their dissent and menendez, i am more, what is more important i havent heard in miami a ton of echoes voicing theirs, i have heard more support and thank goodness this is finally happen. Rose it has been 50 years. Yes, and it is logical, finally our policy is reflecting logic and compassion and not eventual rose those listening to this and careless about the political or economidy mentions but simply because they are adventurous and want to go to cuba, when will they see changes they can act on . As far as travel arrangements. Rose sure. Travel, visit, go stay. I think ass an embargo, well the embargo is still law, what obama can do and promised to do in his speech was expand travel possibilities so people to people visas we can assume he is not going to deny people to people visas for virtually anyone at this point. It has become a lot easier to travel to cuba for americans. The problem is it is still very expensive because you have to go through the package tours. They make a week in havana cost an average of 4,000, 5,000. So you can do so, you can go for example on trips to learn about the tobacco i have, trips to learn about art, tobacco industry. I think what the i have has done now is make this easier and bruton the categories and broaden these rules so that it is easier for people to go to the island. However, to have sort of a wholesale normation of, normal station of travel, to have American Airlines to start flying to havana from any number of airports instead of relying on the Charter Companies i think that is going to take lawmakers to take a new look at this and figure out how it should work going forward. Rose what is your love affair with cuba . Oh, i love cuba from the first time i went there because it felt like the strangest place i had ever been. I am, i am not sure you know what i mean. I loved cuba because it was the strangest place i had ever been. From the outside, it looks like it adheres to all of these cliches you have the old buildings, the old cars, things look kind of decrepit but elegant, tremendously elegant, and yet the energy that i found there was so resourceful and interesting and savvy and internationally sophisticated, exciting. So i as a 20yearold studying abroad there felt like this didnt it didnt match what i had been taught in the u. S. To think i would find in cuba nor did it match what people what cliches it would be. Rose what do we know about this intelligence, this spy that we did know about and has been there 20 years and part of the deal . We know very little. We know years ago, roughly 20 years ago the cubans arrested a Cuban National who was a very important intelligence asset for the United States, that this person provided information that led authorities to unmask alemon temperature who because Senior Pentagon official who was one of the nations top experts on cuba and whose recruitment by the cuban government was one of the most startling chapters in the history of espionage. We also know he provided information that led to the arrest of the five cuban spies in miami some 20 years ago. So this was clearly somebody who went on a limb to help americans to provide very useful information for the americans and who the cubans were able to intercept and stop. So, you know, it seems apparent that the American Government went to Great Lengths and considered that it owed this man, you know, a tremendous gratitude and had to do everything in its power to get him to freedom. Rose what can we say about alan gross . About his, that he is tremendously happy to be home. Rose and back with his family. Yes. But what are we asking for . Because he was sort of the linchpin in sort of the reason to have the conversation. Yes. Rose that was one. Even though this has been going on for eight months he has been there five years . Yes. Rose the interesting thing for me, is to understand is how the roles were played by different people who wanted to see this happen, including the pope. Uh. Rose and who else might have played a role . Did canada play a role in providing a venue . Was western europe involved in any way . I think it is interesting the last meeting, the last round of talks happened at the vatican this fall. It is interesting for a number of reasons but one of them the cuban church, the Catholic Church in cuba has a frosty relationship with the government, apparently behind the scenes they were able to bring the American Government and the cuban government together to what sounds like sealed the deal. Rose right. Some weeks ago is really fascinating. Rose talk a little bit more, before we leave here, the idea of what the challenges will be. I mean, what could be the roadblocks that will damage the hopes of people . Ihthink. Rose of an incident. Sure. I think there always have been spoilers. There always have been people on both sides who havent wanted a healthier relationship for a number of reasons. I think in the cuban government system the prospect of a normalized relationship with the United States is going to mark a dramatic change in who they are and what they stand for. They have been telling their people for years that they need to control their life, they need to control the economy very tightly, they need to control their movement because they are on a war footing against a country that is trying to destabilize them. One, once naah is the no longer true i think that the relationship between the cuban government and its people will have to be different and i hope it will lead to a less repressive society and more empowered. And more open society. Absolutely. Rose yes. And i think if i might add to that, i totally agree but i think down that, the cuban government has used the embargo as the reason why its people request suffer material deprivation for as long as i can remember. I remember one year in havana during a hurricane cain, a terrible hurricane and after it past there were big signs that said that basically indicated that the hurricane was thible fault of the United States because of the embargo and the reason your houses are not being rebuilt is because of the embargo and some of that was true in that instance because people couldnt buy, they couldnt buy Construction Materials from the u. S. Now, to take that excuse away will make the cuban government entirely responsible for its citizens which will have repercussions i can only imagine. It will bring its shortcomings into sharper focus which i believe will be healthy. Rose it is great to have you. Thank you very much. I cant wait to read th the editorial in the New York Times tomorrow morning. Thank you. Thank you. Rose back in a moment. Stay with us. Rose we turn now to the russian economy, the country faces one of its worst financial crisis in year the ruble hit the lowest rate on tuesday, losing after of its value since the start of the year, falling oil prices, and economic flight and