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Where donald trump is also around and donald trump is known for lying. he's known for twisting the truth. he's known for making up the facts. and so it exists in that chasm. howard: right, well therefore what joe biden did was not so bad. >> i'm not forgiving joe biden. howard: no, but a lot of pundits have said it's not really that bad if you look at trump. >> if donald trump is bad for all these different things to have other politicians do very similar things makes their argument not hold as much. >> i think the world is different. in a world where donald trump lies a lot. howard: i have to...

Where donald trump is also around and donald trump is known for lying. he's known for twisting the truth. he's known for making up the facts. and so it exists in that chasm. howard: right, well therefore what joe biden did was not so bad. >> i'm not forgiving joe biden. howard: no, but a lot of pundits have said it's not really that bad if you look at trump. >> if donald trump is bad for all these different things to have other politicians do very similar things makes their argument not hold as much. >> i think the world is different. in a world where donald trump lies a lot. howard: i have to...