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Questions i can't answer and i just don't know. i think it would be slightly surprising if he did. you know, just because all this legal risk against him. mike: president trump has not been shy about expressing his frustration, even anger with his own attorney general and some folks at the justice department. do you get a sense the president is eager to see what the doj inspector general has to say and whether it embarrasses some folks at doj and the fbi? >> yeah, i do. i think the white house is really pinning a lot of hopes on that and thinks that will uncover another aspect of this letter, ...

Being investigated for that. >> that's correct. >> the optics here are obviously pretty terrible. i mean, again, we don't know if michael cohen did anything illegal. >> right. >> certainly we don't know if anything extended anywhere near the president, but on its face, the optics of this and all of these different funds being jumbled into one pot doesn't look good at all. to the point, tara, you did a very good job of laying this out, but it's very confusing. there is no idea where this is going. i think this whole post election collusion argument tends to be approaching. i think most people l...

Manafort. we're learning about robert mueller, his boss in this, of course, rod rosenstein, and their role in the case. also what manafort is trying to do in court. let's go over to evan perez for much more on this. just in court. lay it out for us. what are you learning? >> reporter: i think you can call this the witch-hunt hearing. this is president's name didn't come up in the hearing but very much his argument that this investigation by robert mueller, special counsel, is a witch-hunt. that was the crux of the argument going on in court. and paul manafort's lawyers are simply saying that t...

The import of this investigation, what we know happens with special counsels, sol, i think what joe is saying, what you're looking at better have been going right to the president. and it looks to me like you guys are a lot more experience than i am on this. i haven't practiced law in a long time but it looks like an investigation in search of a crime that they hoped was committed by the president of the united states or the candidate himself. that's why going to vote we started with, they ran out of steam on this collusion argument. then they had to go to the southern district. what can you g...

>> no. and it doesn't -- jake, i've watched your news reports, you know it's not true. he talked about it a week before and i don't know why he did this. all he had to say was, yeah, we met with the russians. the russians offered us something, and we thought they had something, and that was it. i don't know why he went around trying to hide. >> so this, to me, is like the trial balloon on the collusion argument that the argument so far has been trump didn't know about the trump tower meeting between don jr. and jared and the russians. i think the story will become -- he knew about it, but ther...