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Part of the game is going to be about, you know, getting the independents. this is not going to help them get the independents. >> john, the only thing i can remember is history, and i remember it -- people say this isn't going to happen, but i remember in 1964 out here in california in san francisco where moderate republicans were booted out.ç room, people like nelson rockefeller, the behavior by the crazy republican party who ev t eventually nominated a gar who wasn't crazy but appealed to the crazies, barry goldwater, really happens. i can see the tea party people led by bachmann storming...

Two ago starts to become ascended and the establishment takes control headed into the next presidential election. >> well, this party, if the tea party takes over and the mad hatters it start writing the platform, joan, it's going to be kind of odd. i'm older than you. i can remember when the republican senators basically passed the civil rights bill back in '64. led by everitt dirksen. they were all moderates. all reasonable people and they believed in civil rights. can you imagine this crowd meeting and passing a civil rights bill? >> no. they would not do that. they would not. you know, joh...

What i found really interesting is all the things that she tells us it's not going to do, and the reason she's saying that if they set themselves up and they had to repudiate or refudiate as sarah palin would say all the crazy tea party ideas and billboards, et cetera, coming out, they would be there all day and they would be very business, and they would be very sad and unhappy, so they have got a tea party caucus but it doesn't speak for the tea party or talk about anything the tea party believes. okay. fine. >> john, they can't -- i was going to say that they would be responsible, as joan s...

Him. john heilmann. >> that's the governing council there, chris, that you just saw. you know, look, to be fair, it's an interesting thing. you've got this tea party which a lot of us, i think there are obviously parts of the tea party that are very extreme. there are other people who are aligned with the tea party or are sympathetic to it who are standard part of the american electorate. they are radically alienated from government. people who voted for ross perot back in 1992. those people aren't crazy, so it's -- it's an interesting thing because you've got now a that wants the energy of th...

They put walter mondale on the ticket, that the party was way too liberal. the parties tend to swing to an extreme. they suffer a huge devastating electoral loss and then they come back to their senses and start moving back towards the middle. you can see this happening. like i say, if the republicans win the house and also win the senate especially, you can imagine heading into this 2012 election someone like sarah palin or someone who is able to appeal to sarah palin's voters, and it's noticeable. you know, one of the things that happened today was that someone you might never have expected ...