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Be in line with your reporting that their whole strategy is a pr strategy. is that because there is no viable legal strategy at this point? that they don't know what they don't know and think the president may very well be in trouble? >> the legal team certainly finds themselves in the dark and mueller has done an enormous amount of work here. and the president's lawyers still don't appreciate how much mueller has and what the president's true exposure is. and what the justice department will actually do with any information they have about the president. will it be a report to congress that's...

White house counsel mcgahn, has a unique insight. if anyone is going to know about the possibility of russian influence or offers of help, that will be the person to know about it. >> in the end, shan, what we're seeing from donald trump's legal team right now is this very clearly, and i don't know if it needs to be anything but this, but it's a pr strategy, not a legal strategy, right? >> it's primarily a pr strategy. i think all along, they have been looking towards the possibility of the political arena of impeachment. it's a legal strategy to the extent that they continue to try to send, i...

Let's listen to that exchange. >> it's nothing to do with the president. nothing to do with collusion. everything to do with a lobbyist who acted improperly who the president doesn't know. i mean, so far every indictment is unrelated to the president. we went through an entire manafort trial and there wasn't a single mention of the president. >> this was related directly to the inauguration. >> not to the president. millions of people donated to the president, the inauguration. if they get caught violating something, that's connected to the president? >> harry, it is an interesting pr strategy...

Window, because of this purported policy. >> and to your point, it may not be a legal strategy, but at least you can safely say it's a pr strategy, right? hold on. let me -- that was just an off-the-cuff remark there. but ben, i wanted you to listen to leon panetta. this morning he was on talking about the special counsel investigation. take a listen. >> bob mueller is focusing on several things right now. obviously, he's gone after individuals and he's gone after russians that were involved in coming after our election system. they are getting very close to making a case for obstruction of ju...

Been questions raised about the testimony of donald trump jr. >> right. that list could be long. >> that could be a whole new horizon for mueller. >> so, harry, as expected, rudy giuliani was asked to comment on this. let's listen to that exchange. >> it's nothing to do with the president. nothing to do with collusion. everything to do with a lobbyist who acted improperly who the president doesn't know. i mean, so far every indictment is unrelated to the president. he went through an fientire manafort trial. not to the president. millions of people donated to the president, the inauguration. i...