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Obsessed with all of media attention. his reference points are a little bit dated. you know, no knock on "time" magazine but the world has moved on to vast numbers of media outlets in addition to "time" magazine but it's precious, still precious real estate and the president as we all know believes in the best locations and the "time" magazine cover i think is one of the best locations in journalistic real estate. >> go on. i was going to ask you, brian, when you look back on this week, do you think we're going to see this is a tipping point for the trump administration? >> this is one thing w...

Also deep concern is that when you begin to destabilize people's view of objective truth, then you can reorganize in that confusion the values at what is acceptable and the legalities that emanate from that. you can then uproot women's rights and civil rights and voting rights and anything else you want because we've now shiftishif shifted the reference points of what the country defines as what is right and what is wrong. >> yeah. that's right. reverend. we have a totalitarian sitting behind the resolute degs being in the oval office. we have a liar. we have a racist, a white supremacist. we ...

Stephenson, heather mcgee and i think we wanted to try and really get professional people to help us understand and walk in the shoes of people of color and understand that racial bias does exist, unconscious bias exists and what can we do as a company to create the reference points to establish empathy and compassion in a welcoming environment for everyone. >> for critics who say, this is an afternoon, how on earth can you tackle racial bias in an afternoon? >> one of the most important things to do is we need to have the conversation. we need to start. we realize that four hours of training ...

Water boarding and sleep deprivation and do you think torture self a morally acceptable. >> great question. i hope you don't hear me if you do make sure you hammer me to be claiming i'm on the moral high ground. i'm a flawed person. what i try to do and inspire to do especially learned from others is figure out how to make decisions as a leader with ethical considerations in mind with the external reference points. i hope you read the book. one of the things i talk about in the book is the struggle over torture. torture is not morally acceptable under any circumstances. the challenge we faced ...

What will fill this hole in me, get me the affirmation i crave? and that is deeply concerning. because the only way you make hard decision is by looking to the external reference point. your first move and primary move is is always to the external reference points. so, that's why i say that. >> you say what you say is the president's need for affirmation, is that something you saw in conversations with him? he was looking for something for you positive, something to affirm, something to make him feel good? >> yes, at least with me, his style of conversation was a series of assertions about gre...