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The white house or omb. around the same time sondland, volker, giuliani, they're talking deliverables with ukrainians, same time he's with omb about who controls the money. they're talking with ukraine about who gets the money. the only piece of evidence that muddies what seems to be a clear effort to pressure the ukraines to get after the bidens and conspiracy theory is one phone call, this mysterious september 9th phone call where the president said all the right things to sondland. remember, he made those notes, checked every box. he even used the latin phrase that the whistleblower did in ...

>> ken starr started out looking at real estate and he wound up with a sex act. that's legitimate? that was the worst. let's never compare anything to that if you want any leverage. >> you're the one that raised it. >> i'm raising it that you guys are living that hypocrisy. elie says you don't see any connection between the aid and the deliverables. you said it's all hearsay, all hearsay, even though it's b.s. because we're in a place where hearsay is okay. why was rudy giuliani talking to omb -- >> because the process is flawed. >> why was rudy giuliani talking to omb at around the same time ...

Else, the interests of the president. the fact that he now is contacting omb, it really raises the specter that there is not a single shred of credibility to the claim that the holding back of that aid had anything to do with fighting corruption in ukraine which has been the president and his defenders' last line of defense saying well, yes, he did all these things but he did it because he's concerned about corruption in ukraine. giuliani's involvement with omb and likely involvement with the holding up of that vital aid cuts the legs out from under that defense. >> and how it ties together wi...

House officials. so, one thing's for sure, this parnas is not just some guy on the outside who doesn't know anything. he's in there. now we know rudy took credit for getting the u.s. ambassador removed. but the day she was ordered home, he talked to the white house eight times, all right? the next day, joe biden announced he's running for the white house. we now know for sure what the president wanted. the question for the democrats is can you show that's why aid was withheld. now, that takes us to august 8th. mark sandy at omb, the agency that controlled the aid, remember, he testified. he sa...