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Michael, that wikileaks has the same kind of protections as a news organization, even though as far as we know they don't provide news content but they provide information. >> that's right. again, there are good minds that disagree with me on this, maybe better minds that disagree with me on this, but i believe when they're a distributor of news like the snowden stuff, they're under first amendment protection. cia director pompeo thinks tlaer a none state hostile intelligence service. if that's muf's view, then they would deal with them not as a media organization and intelligence service. i d...

That he did, what kind of protections might wikileaks have in this investigation that they may have obtained information, that they may have passed it on our publicized it? are there protections? >> yeah, it's a great question. wikileaks, according to u.s. law enforcement, is a nonstate, hostile intelligence service. according to many, it's the first amendment protected news organization. if it is a news organization, then they stand like "the washington post" did when it received the pentagon papers. >> is that how wikileaks defines itself, that it is a news organization? it obtains informati...

East germany and like so many people that grew up behind the iron curtain look to america just as reagan said, is a city shining brightly on the hill for all the world to see, one of the first things that happened after the wall came down, she and her husband got on a plane, flew to california, and understood america really was all she believed it was, and -- >> when that fell apart she said we'll take as many refugees from syria. >> i thought you were going to say when george bush tried to massage her shoulders. >> and she thought obama was going to provide support and obama said no. he didn'...

Why is this different? >> it's potentially huge because the way wikileaks released this information is by claiming these cyber weapons, these hacking tools have actually left the cia, no longer in the control of the cia, they've been leaked. the idea here is potentially the entire cia's hacking arsenal is now outside of their control and potentially in the hands of cyber criminals who can steal the personal information or bank account numbers orman any from people like you and me or it's reached the hands of former intelligence who can crack down on pro democracy dissidents. the potential here...

President of the united states or he can defend his agency. that's a really tough place to be. when you have the president sort of making these kind of wild accusations, and clearly, according to what we've heard from aides to the president, did not even contact the fbi to ask for clarification of any of this stuff, the fbi is seen as either sort of a tool of the president whose authority can be sort of slung around, and it's implied that the fbi, if anybody was going to do the wiretapping, might have done it or at least known of it, or they're seen as off to the side and a player that doesn't...