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Amazing man. he doesn't get credit wrfrb. >> what about the credit. you heard lindsey graham saying he sees a grand bargain in the future. he's putting the revenues of the republicans on the future. >> the psychology has been all wrong. build a bunker is not how you change the psychology of a troubled economy. two things, let the republicans pulling him right toward spending cuts because that's the policy solution they need. and i'll give him credit, he's read the clnten handbook and tried to triangulate, and the more he heat he takes on the left, the closer he is to a real deal, and second, p...

Bernanke, he understands there's bad unemployment, he's an amazing man. he doesn't get credit wrfrb. >> what about the credit. you heard lindsey graham saying he sees a grand bargain in the future. he's putting the revenues of the republicans on the future. >> the psychology has been all wrong. build a bunker is not how you change the psychology of a troubled economy. two things, let the republicans pulling him right toward spending cuts because that's the policy solution they need. and i'll give him credit, he's read the clnten handbook and tried to triangulate, and the more he heat he takes ...

Numbers. and -- and the key word there is balanced. if you actually run the numbers given what we've cult so far, we've actually cut $1.5 trillion in spending. that was part of the 2011 budget control act. don't let anybody tell you we've not cut any spending. we have. we've just increased taxes by 600 billion in the fiscal cliff deal. if you kind of put all the numbers together, we need another 1.2 trillion in deficit savings to get to a point where the debt is no longer growing faster than gdp. that stabilizes the depth-to-gdp ratio. 1.2 trillion sounds like a lot, but that's over ten years,...

Negotiation will take place. but if boehner feels like he can accomplish something on the spending cut side in that negotiation, then he'll come out a little bit just fine i think. >> you know, karen, do you think the president's in a stronger position for having his vice president, joe biden, on his team? i mean, look at what he did during the fiscal cliff fight last weekend, do you think he'll be used in the debt ceiling debate? >> absolutely. biden has on a number of occasion really been the key figure in some of these negotiations. although i do want to say i feel like i should just give c...

They're still wrangling on, and we won't know how that shakes out until maybe the end of tonight, maybe tomorrow, maybe wednesday. >> i want to bring the panel back in. we've just got tony one of the many ironies of this debate, and i want to go over to ben white. morning monday on twitter. republicans complaining there's not enough spending cuts in it, but, yet, they want to cancel the biggest chunk of spending cuts, which are the cuts to defense. that's where the money is. why is it that republicans both want to rye duce deficit but not do it with spending cuts, and they want to hire tax inc...