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The editors did vote the way they did. >> he's the only head of state that can allow pictures of himself shirtless on horseback to be all over the world. >> i think religious figures are also judged on how much financial power they have. it's a preposterous joke. and we should treat it with the contempt it thoroughly deserves. >> we apologize here. >> david gergen. >> just saying if you have a different kind of judging, let's say the top ten thugs in the world then vad minute putin could well be on the top of that list. the problem you have with this list is, let's take you take this kind of s...

Usually gdp. corporate leaders that's revenue. and for religious leaders, it's their finances. we look at how many followers or people they have power over. so for the pope, 20% of the world's population is catholic. we also look at are they powerful in multiple spheres. so somebody like mayor bloomberg who's a politician, a billionaire, a major philanthropist and media mogul is powerful in many different ways. then we look at whether or not they are active in using their power. and we have eight of of our editors vote on everybody, candidate list of about 150 people. then we rank them. and th...

Should. [ overlapping speakers ] >> his relationship with capitol hill? would that be another example for you he leaves it to others? >> if you talk to people on the hill, republicans have a huge amount of hatred. way beyond what it should be. but i think if you talk to democrats you find they find he's disengaged. i have a theory, may be wrong, in the domestic side, i think to a considerable degree in foreign policy, he has centralized power in the white house. he's disempowered a lot of people in the cabinet agencies. they're treated much more like staff than real cabinet officers. he's not ...

Bad catholic tonight because he can damn the rest of the list to hell. so that to me is power. >> he isn't damning anyone to hell. >> i think the pope should be number one. this man has single-handedly done more to save the church in recent times and to change the perception of the church than anyone in my lifetime. >> you won't get any argument on that. >> that makes him the most powerful man in the world? >> yes. he's got power over me. >> there's the ability to do whatever you want, putin would be at the top of that list, and then there is power to control things that are powerful like in r...