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Reenforcement for exactly every color of cynicism and suck we have about covid. people who are anti-vax are hesitant or against mandates or getting fueled into this thing of big brother, they're going to support him. even though it may be the case he's done everything wrong. on the other side, people are going to want to see him canceled. i don't think that's right, either. i want to hear him own it. that's what we need. that's what everybody needs -- the fans, society, someone to just own the truth. >> well new, no matter how anti-science, anti-facts, anti-common sense some of the anti-vaxxer...

On the other side, people are going to want to see him canceled. i don't think that's right, either. i want to hear him own it. that's what we need. that's what everybody needs -- the fans, society, someone to just own the truth. >> well, no matter how anti-facts, anti-science, anti-common sense some of the anti-vaxxers are, people like carson wentz and cole beasley and kirk cousins in the nfl are more celebrated, certainly the more focus case of kyrie irving in the nba, say whatever you want they've all owned it. they've all come out and say this is what i believe, this is what i'm doing. aar...

The objective, namely, feeding fears, not with facts. facts be damned. no proof of truth necessary. case in point. a conspiracy theory that has been played mostly for laughs. bizarre claim. made on national tv. two american companies were working with a dead venezuelan dictator. listen. >> we had a report that the heads of dominion and smartmatic, somewhere in the mid teens, 13, 14, whatever, went down to venezuela for a get to know meeting with maduro so they could demonstrate to maduro the kind of vote fixing they did for

Against the virus of lies and hate that you're talking about. >> i'm with you. but so much of the truth is about -- or people accepting something as true, it's about who is telling them it. that's why i have some hope for this iteration, because it's about documents. you can't like or dislike documents. they say what they say. hopefully if you get paper, people will see it as a reasonable basis to make an informed opinion. norm eisen, thank you for being on the show. >> thanks, chris. now, i'm off tomorrow night. but the game is on. you can have a cnn special report "trumping democracy, an a...

Move quicker than some fear. >> am i wrong to be cynical about the impact of the outcome, to see -- i see support for trump as people using him as a proxy for their animus against the entire system. he's never been an anecdote, he's always been a virus, injected into the system because people hate it. will that change? >> chris, i think we -- we've already seen a national dawning as to what trump represents. as these facts come out, they will have impact. that is why this litigation, the civil liable litigation you were talking about earlier on the show, this litigation over the committee's su...