Transcripts For CSPAN Hearing On The Internet Of Things 20240622

Devices such as cars and Household Appliances. Among the witnesses is a gary shapiro of the Consumer Electronics association. And a number with the a number with the automobile manufacturers. The chair is authorized to declare a recess of the subcommittee at any time. Today, we welcome everyone for a hearing on the internet of things. Throughout its short history the internet has been transformative and powerful tool. It has a doubling capacity so quickly that by the time you run out of your short warranty, you in fact, have a product that can outperform the one on your desk. But the internet of things, which probably refers to a Network Connected to realworld items, able to Exchange Data with each other and across existing Network Infrastructure is a newer version of what now becomes the future of our lives and our communication in the 21st century. It is estimated by 2020, there will be 25 billion connected things. Without a doubt before we reach 2020, i will be wrong and there will be more connected things. By embedding devices with software capable of connecting a market we have smart devices. Smarter devices today already include, if you choose, every light switch in your home, the watch you wear, and products throughout the home, whether they be speakers to hear from, or in fact sensors to control climate down to a portion of every room. Data driven technology is also improving the way we understand health care, and the introduction of new Health Monitoring systems can in fact prevent, detect, and treat today any number of afflictions. A generation ago, the insulin pump was an amazing product. But it wasnt a true demand pump. It wasnt connected to your physician. It wasnt, in fact, sensing other environments. Today, it not only could, but it soon will. At the same time as we talk about your home, your lighting, your messaging, your voice, and of course your health and actual biological function, issues like privacy and Data Security for these approval technologies operable technologies become a not just something to talk about, but in area in which we in Congress Play a large and potentially destructive role if we are not careful in the development of these technologies. Every day in america somewhere someone is being hacked, and somewhere, someone is finding out that their personally identifiable information has been compromised. Too often, it is in fact the government that we hear it from. The government who controls, if you will, whether or not you can further secure your internet of things products or not. A generation ago, i stood with one of our witnesses at a time in which a member of congress, the former fbi agent, was trying to prevent 256 encryption. He was doing so because the fbi needed to crack the bad guys transitions. Transmissions. They needed to be able to unbundle a floppy dislkl information if they were going to be able to deter organized crime. Unfortunately it meant that hackers were taking microsofts operating system and quickly duplicating it and denying them millions of billions of dollars. Its took a number of years for congress to realize that that artificial control was not only circumvent double circumventable, but it was ludicrous, because the bad guys were not going to limit their protection to 256 bits. Unlicensed speculating within the internet of things is going to be talked about again and again today. I hope my witnesses will feel free to talk about the benefits of greater spectrum for the internet of things. I would remind all panelists however, notthat the fcc is not within our primary jurisdiction. But to unbundle these things will take coordination between committees that do control spectrum, those of us who control a great deal of the primacy requirements and the overseeing of what government allows. In january, the federal trade commission released a report that followed months of roundtables on a data privacy and security. The report made a broad nonbinding recommendation on how companies should address these issues from the onset, and laid out the groundwork for future ftc involvement in the internet of things. When covers women delve any congresswoman dell benny and i launched the Congress Caucus of the internet of things in january, the question is what is the internet of things, and why does Congress Care . We have laid out a number of those, even in my Opening Statement today. But i would be remiss if i didnt say that the ftc is an agency that has been in forcing enforcing breaches in security but providing guidance. This is yet another example of where we can come in with the heavy hand of government, but seldom with a safe haven. That is an area in which the internet of things caucus and this committee have an obligation to ensure that we do both. I look forward to a hearing with stakeholders in the internet of things. And further opportunities to deal with just challenges that congress brings, and those that we can bring relief. Thank you and i look forward to our witnesses. I know recognize mr. Nadler for his Opening Statements. The internet of things to the next revolution in our increasingly wired world. Everything from Household Appliances to Transportation Systems can harness the power of the internet to increase productivity, efficiency, and consumer choice. This Technology Holds great promise for consumers businesses and government alike. But we must also address security and privacy that involves massive data collection. Todays hearing is an opportunity to analyze the benefit and risk that internet presents. The internet of things is expressing expose of growth in recent years. By some estimates, there are already 25 billion and a kid devices today. By 2020, in five short years there may be as many as 50 billion. We are seeing many innovative uses of the internet of things, across various industries, as well as the potential risks that this may hold. 21 study by 2020, one study by 2020, a number of cars will have an internet connection. With this technology, drivers can determine whether their car needs maintenance and even the fuel efficiency of various routes. But these are burial vulnerable to cyber attacks. As the New York Times described last week, the internet can track a cars location, turn off the blinkers, when chilled wipers and radios, interfere with navigation devices, and in some cases, control their breaks and steering. As more and more vehicles use internet technology, it is vital that automakers install security features to ward off potential attacks. Similarly, some smart cities are incorporating the internet of things into Transportation Energy and even Waste Management systems to increase efficiency. For example, traffic lights can be tied to maximize traffic flow in ease congestion in realtime. Speed ramps to conserve energy when no one is around. Trash can scan signal when trash ought to be collected. Such technology has the potential to revolutionize investiture. Infrastructure. But unless we integrate Strong Security measures when employing this technology, the intersection would be vulnerable to attack by hackers or terrorists seeking to bring a city to a standstill. In addition to security concerns the internet raises a host of privacy implications, particularly with respect to consumer devices. There is no doubt that internet enabled technology can improve a consumers life. Your thermostat can be controlled remotely and learn your patterns. Amazon introduced the dash button, which lets people automatically reorder household supplies. What are these companies do with the massive amount of data they collect about their customers . What notice do they provide to consumers about their privacy policies and what choice do consumers have about how their information is used . How are companies protecting Sensitive Information from being comprised in a cyber attack . These are all questions that must be considered as this technology continues to expand its reach. Another example, millions of americans have devices that relate to health care. One Insurance Company is endorsing a device to encourage healthy lifestyles. It is not clear how else insurance compete may seek to use this personal information in the future. Would it be sold for marketing purposes . Would it be used in a disco montgomery manner is committed torry manner for discriminatory manner for credit . This is why the ftc made a number of recommendations we must consider. It recommended that they monitor connected devices throughout their expected lifestyle and provide 30 patches to cover risks. Provide security patches. Also providing notice and choices to consumers as to how their data might be used. Although the ftc didnt make legislative recommendations we should consider whether the congressional act is appropriate at this time to address security concerns. If so, should we Seek Solutions to these concerns that are specific to the internet of things, or should they be addressed to broader legislation . The internet of things already went through technological breakthroughs. It has the potential to spur tremendous innovation. Our challenge is to find the proper balance between promoting this innovation and ensuring that are privacy and security is protected as this valuable technology grows. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses on how to address these challenges. I yield back the balance of my time. I now recognize the gentleman from virginia, the chairman mr. Goodlatte. Mr. Goodlatte we are here to hear more about the internet of things. This technology has the ability to not only improve the more mundane aspects of our lives but transform health care, transportation and Information Technology industries. This new area of technology is of particular interest to the judiciary committee, considering our longstanding jurisdiction with issues like intellectual property, Cloud Computing, and digital trade. The internet of things refers to machines containing sensors connect and transmit it up to other connected devices and the internet. Dramatic growth in Cloud Computing over the past several years has enabled this technology to reach its full potential. Without the ability for data of an internet of things device that can be analyzed in realtime, the data itself would serve little value. The ability to access this information through mobile apps or even our cars makes this internet of things devices a key tool to finding Creative Solutions for many of the problems of daily life in the 21st century. Smart agriculture help us to grow more food and prevent waste. Smart transportation help us prevent traffic jams. But can also be used to monitor Road Conditions and structural components of bridges and overpasses to detect problems immediately. New wearables not only monitor the number of steps we take, but can include sensors that can catch an alert us to potential medical emergencies before it becomes ones. At this committee studies this new technology, its important for us to keep in mind the full scope of the internet of things and be cognizant of its effects on Public Policy today and in the future. In particular, we need to examine the privacy and Security Locations of this technology and look into the security and privacy measures the industry is building now and the measures they intend to implement as open standards are developed. I am hopeful that this new technology will help fuel the engine of american innovation, prosperity, and creativity. I think we have a fantastic panel assembled today. I know all of the witnesses and i look forward to hearing from all of them about this exciting new area of technology. Thank you mr. Chairman. On behalf of the Ranking Member, the gentlelady from washington. I want to thank my cochair on the internet of things as well as the Ranking Member for calling this hearing on this important subject. I want to examine the way that the internet connected products and sensors are being used in what is called the internet of things. From appliances to personal wearables. It may be easy will include that it is limited only by american ingenuity. But we had an emerging set of challenges and opportunities to address for both innovators and consumers. To start we need to make sure that we update existing laws to reflect the way the world works today and where we are headed in the future. That means, for example updating the electronic munication privacy act Electronic Communications privacy act to make sure a server is protected in the same way a file in a file cabinet is. We need to be responsible stewards of policy. Consumers must feel they can trust their devices will be secure and private, not vulnerable to hacking or spiking. Devices must be able to talk to each other. That means forging a path to adoption of the uniform preferably International Standards from regulatory agencies that must find ways to strike the right balance between encouraging innovation and firmly upholding their duty to protect the Public Health and safety particularly in the realm of connected cars. As all of these devices collect unprecedented amounts of data, they provided great promise for things like health research. We much work with we must work with stakeholders that internet of things users can understand that provides uers with control over their own data. I want to thank the chairman and Ranking Member for calling todays important hearing. Thank you mr. Chairman, and i yield back. Thank you for your leadership on this issue. It is now my pleasure to introduce our distinguished panel, with written statements entered into the record. They will be placed in their entirety. I asked the witnesses to summarize in about five minutes their statements so that we can leave timef for lots of questions. Before i introduce the witnesses formally pursuant to the Committee Rules i would ask all witnesses stand to take the of. Take the oath. Customarily raising the right hand. Let the record reflect that all witnesses answered in the affirmative. Today our witnesses include mr. Gary shapiro president and ceo of the Consumer Electronics association. Mr. Dean garfield, president and ceo of the technology and information consul. Mr. Pitch greenwald, part of the alliance of automobile manufacturers. In mr. Morgan reed, executive director of the apt association. Act association. Before i go down the road for the witnesses i have to take a bit of a personal privilege. The other three know it. Mr. Shapiro and i go back a long time. We were there at the birth of the modern Consumer Electronics association. I once worked for him on an unpaid, highly commentated, but unpaid position highly compensated, but unpaid position as the chairman. If i roughed him up, remember that givebacks take a while. [laughter] now mr. Shapiro. Mr shapiro this is a historic moment in my life, because i have been referring to you as boss for a number of years. Thank you mr. Good lot and other chairman as well. We own and produce ces which is held each january in las vegas. The World Largest novation event. Innovation event. Ces is so big that some 900 of our 3600 exhibitors have an internet of things about in a recent show. One thing that you should know exists because of smartphones. Over one billion smart phones have been sold, they contain some called mims. Microelectronic mechanical systems. Tiny devices that actually moved and measure all sorts of things like pressure, temperature location movement, and other valuable information. Because of the billions of cells in these phones, they cost pennies a piece. They are creating new Services Rather rapidly. They use very Little Energy and hook up to the internet. That is what the internet of things is based on. With fitness trackers and Baby Monitors to Household Appliances to connected cars, consumers are using these devices to stay healthy, increase efficiency, to be secure, and to make better decisions. Youve heard of the estimates of how these are going to grow. And they are estimates. I just wanted to tell the truth i cant say they are factual. But there is definite growth. We grew 32 in the u. S. Alone through connected home devices. It is already an almost 1 billion market place. These home control systems allow consumers to manage security systems, manage heating and cooling. They also increase home efficiency and cut bills. They can learn rote patterns over time. They can adjust temperatures and maximize efficiency, even when no one is home. There is an opportunity here to care for our aging population as well as the millions of those with disabilities. These can be customized and costly. These products provide novel interfaces like voice control. Smoke detectors can now be connected to lighting control so that lights can flash to those who cant hear, they can light up the whole house were a safe exit. These products are lifestage lifechanging. Think about our older loved ones. We have limited caregivers in an aging population. These devices will let seniors live comfortably. They can do this with caregivers watching remotely, and at the same time, Older Americans will retain their privacy and share just what they are comfortable sharing. Its coming quickly, but it does face some impediments. First, it requires section wireless section is the platform in which most of these devices connect. We need additional licensed and unlicensed spectrum. Second, the internet of things is changing with skills need to complain maintain our competitive vantage. We dont have enough skilled workers. That is why we are pushing for highly skilled depression reform. Third, the internet of things requires government restraint. The legitimate concerns about safety, privacy, security, and important veterans are being raised about who owns this data. Stakeholders, including government should be discussing these issues, like we are today. The fcc said that consumer adoption builds on maintaining trust manufacturers needs to make good decisions about privacy and security. We are passionate industry driven solutions are best. We recognize and respect the legitimate role of government and encourage transparency, clarity, and experiment tatian. Experimentation. This is just beginning. But we have to be careful about stymieing in the growth of internet change. Government action should focus on a real harm. This is an opportunity to change the world, and we look forward to working with this committee to make sure government regulations promote growth in the sector. I look forward to your questions. Thank you mr. Shapiro. Mr. Garfield. Mr. Garfield thank you members of the committee. On behalf of 61 of the most Dynamic Companies in the world we thank you for hosting this hearing. We also thank you for the context which is outside pending legislation. It is our firm view that the internet of things has the potential to be one of the most transformative technological inventions in human history. That is, with the right policy environment. To ensure that i am not accused of engaging in hyperbolic hyperventilation, i want to focus my testimony on three areas. One, why we think that is the case. Two, what we are doing to enable it. Third, our humble recommendations on how congress and the administration can be helpful. The internet of things is essentially the digitization of the digital world. Through connecting sensors into a network with computing systems. What may sound simple has the potential to be seismic. The creation of new industries as well as disruption of existing ones. Whether were talking about watches that have the potential to not only help you to be more fit but as well as prevent Catastrophic Health incidents through monitoring heart rate. Or talking about windshield wipers that have the ability to indicate with other winchell wipers and alert your cart when impending storm, or alert and Autonomous Vehicle about a Construction Zone that is soon arriving. There is much discussion of the home and personal manifestations of the internet of things, which are truly exciting. It is important however, not to ignore the potential commercial is appointed. Commercial meant appoint ments. They have huge potential economic benefits. Whether it is the myth of sensors in our energy grid to ensure the department of sensors. In Transportation Systems to allow more efficient delivery. Or in mines to ensure safety for workers. The Economic Impact will come mostly from those deployments, which by 2030 is expected to be almost 7 trillion. What are we doing at the Technology Sector to ensure that is the case . We are focused on a multifaceted approach that heavily emphasizes security odyssey Security Privacy standards as well as investment in infrastructure. We are working in innovating all the time around those issues, making sure that security and privacy are developed by design so that they are part of our forethought rather than an afterthought. We want to ensure that both security and privacy are tailored to the particular environment. And as well, we are investing in innovation. Consumers man a highsecurity demand highsecurity and privacy. It is in our interest and the right thing to do to meet those consumer demand. As well, were moving forward on Global Standards that are privately driven by the sector. And ones that are open to ensure that we have high int eroperability as well as scalability. Mr. Shapiro noted the need for broadband, both wifi and wireless. Making sure that spectrum is available. In reality, the use of the spectrum is growing on mobile data by 55 each year. With the internet of things and the digitization of physical things, it will only grow more expeditiously. The spectrum will be increasingly important. In addition to doing those things, we intend and need to partner with congress and the administration to make sure that policy is smartly developed. There are three things that harbors can focus that congress can focus on. One, we need a National Strategy, the same way that a National Broadband plan was able to focus our attention and drive the deployment of broadband. Having a National Strategy around the internet of things will be incredibly helpful. Second, we need more spectrum, as mr. Shapiro and i pointed out earlier. The u. S. Government is the largest holder of the spectrum, and hence has the greatest ability to impact the deployment of spectrum. We hope we can work towards making it more efficient. Finally, we need the exercise of restraint. The internet of things is at natal stages, in order to reach its full potential, it is important that we avoid mandate that put the thumb on the scale of particular technologies versus others. I look forward to your questions and the testimony of my colleagues. Thank you. Mr. Greenwald you only have to do with the questions set in the Opening Statements. I am part of another history industry dealing with technology. Axis begin to replace ownership. Access began to replace ownership. Now i am with the alliance of automobile manufacturers for the last four years. I came up with mr. Shapiro. Mr. Shapiro only in washington. Mr. Brainwol technology and connectivity usher in a new era some might say a golden age in mobility. Weve seen an enormous number of safety and environment of gains in the last halfcentury, striking down mortality numbers. The next generation of progress will come from iotbased technologies. The truly Material Impact of technology is the convergence of environmental safety conductivity and quality benefits that arise from conductivity of an iot world. Do you go heavy and safe, or lig ht and green . Now the company should of automation combination of automation and connectivity harmonizes safety and green. It manages a car better than a human can. It fosters more mobility, with fewer crashes on the road generating congestion. Fewer crashes translate into more economic productivity, more personal time, fewer injuries and fatalities, lower emissions and lest waste of fuel. In an iot world where connectivity promises these truly mighty metal and if its truly monumental benefits. 90 of all traffic fatalities result from human error or environmental conditions. Vehicle errors count for just a fraction. This can mitigate human error. Things like lane departure warning, automatic braking blind spot warnings. Ultimately, self driving vehicles. These innovations must be embraced and seen as the answer and not a problem. That means working proactively to address concerns of Cyber Security and privacy. Lats year, auto manufacturer began the first in the iot in that sector to adopt a set of privacy principles to protect vehicle owners. It is based on fcc guidance, and suggestions from privacy advocates. Geolocation is a sensitive technology. The privacy principles require clear and prominent notice about the collection of such information, the purposes of why it is collected, and the entities with which it can be shared. Similarly, the industry is working to stay ahead of the threat posed by malicious hackers. Earlier announced the formation of a industrywide portal to share information about existing or potential Cyber Threats and vulnerabilities. The Alliance Supports Cyber Security bills and house. Bills in the house. We hope the senate acts soon. Members of the committee, the next years in the evolution of the internet is enormously exciting and promises extraordinary outcomes on of the road. We look forward to working with you to realize the benefits of innovation and to address the challenges that come along the way. Thank you. My name is morgan reed, executive director of the app association. My association presents more than 5000 companies and Technology Firms around the world. We are currently spearheading an effort to a Health Initiative clarify outdated Health Relations and incentivize the use of Remote Monitoring and and and direct where patients and consumers see and improve it in their health. We need congress and the fda to support policies that help keep Sensitive Health data private and secure. Traditionally this is a moment in my oral testimony or i should cite some interesting numbers and jobs filled. I want to break from that a bit. I want to tell you a story that i know is relevant to many of you, certainly a huge chunk of your constituents. Nearly everyone in this room has a aging parent or know someone that is. Many of your parents are living in their own home, but significant medical challenges are beginning to face them. Do i get a home health attended . Do we pay as much as 12,000 a month to move them into a assisted living facility . Do they move into my basement . How do i deal with the fact that my parents dont want to move into my basement . What do i do to help them live at home with the dignity . Most of you remember like alert life alert. That kind of device is known as a personal Emergency Response system. We call them pers. These are great devices, but incredibly limited to what they can do. Imagine a far more sophisticated pers with sensors that can attract blood pressure, heart rate, geo sensing for all summers patients alzheimers patients and much more. It can fit in a watch like this one. I think everyone here has got one. All of those devices connect to a loved ones phone and medical record. Suddenly mom can stay at home, maybe another gear, maybe two or 3. All while managing her health. If mom allows the data to be sent to you, you can be part of the solution. Staying in touch and on top of her need. And not insignificantly your basement can keep its bigscreen tv. By 2050, there will be 83. 7 million americans over the age of 65. Twice the amount from 2012. 80 will have at least one chronic condition. Without congestion, this rapid growth will strain private resources. This is not a what is standing in the way of this stream . Innovation helps healthcare. Italy to lowercost, better care two the future of health iot will be built on trust. Three, regulatory barriers, outdated laws, and lack of clarity around reimbursement for a threat to the advancement of mobile health. Congress can, and in some cases must play in a peripheral in improving Health Outcomes for all americans. Questions about Privacy Security reimbursement, and government relation crated an indictment or companies are working about viability. Patience and care providers must know their information is private and secure. Best practices around the dealing of health data is imported to establishing trust and pushing this industry forward. As most of this Health Information will eventually end up in the cloud. Congress should be pushing back on any Government Measure to weaken encryption. Finally, ensuring that doctors are reimbursed for the use of these technologies will be essential. Currently, cms is prevented from reimbursing remote patient monitoring because of absurd geographical extensions. Successful commlink Technology Means to pay for it all comes together. I ask that that happens now rather than see one more of our family members moving out of the home they live because we failed to act. I look forward to your questions. On that note, i have questions. I recognize myself for a series of questions. Mr. Shapiro you are not a engineer. You are a long recovery lawyer. I think your industry is well aware of the answer. As we sit here, what percentage is the bandwidth we are using in this room . Of the entire spectrum . Mr. Shapiro what what percentage . If you are thinking about am, fm, the old bed with from television, what percentage . Less than 1 will be in these airwaves . I said i would not dwell too much on the spectrum, but if we are trying to create the ability for almost an unlimited amount of communications between large and small devices, is it one of our greatest tasks to recognize that we have allocated all bandwidth virtually and not used hardly any of it . Yes, now i realize you give me a softball. You can follow up with the devices that recognize those and take advantage of them. Mr. Shapiro all spectrums are putting much the same. We categorize them through the lost a family. We categorize whether it is licensed or unlicensed. Unlicensed means subject to Good Neighbor both, anyone can use it. Good neighbor rules. In a study we did last year, there is cd 2 billion of activity created by 62 mbillion. It allows innovators to do really cool things to provide benefits. Theres a lot of spectrum that the government uses. We ask that the government catalog and figure out what can be repurposed for commercial purposes. That only takes some of the pressure off a very crowded field, but creates a huge amount of economic activity. And if so, would make a tremendous amount of money for the treasury. There is technology being developed which allows spectrum to be more finely used. We are passionate about the Driverless Cars. We think there is an opportunity to test some of the spectrum in that area and share it. That is what we would love to have wonderful conversations about. There is going to be a lot of questions whether or not automobiles that are communicating with the internet are safe or not. Would it be fair to say that whether or not you share the bandwidth has virtually nothing to do with whether or not you will be effectively hacked on your encrypted signals . That they softball thats a softball. Im also not an engineer. I would say if you things. One, as it relates to spectrum, we have heard the message from congress. The notion of sharing, if we can make that work, that is something we really wants to do. Field tests will happen. Meeting safety inheritors, that balance must be struck. I want to set a context in terms it could indicate or lemonade of 280 it could eliminate 80 of crashes on the road. The implications are enormous. The predicate for moving forward relates to aggressively moving forward but it doing no harm. The history of data in the automobile involved having preparatory data buses not publishing. As a representative, is that going to be different in the vehicle to vehicle world it has to be an open standard, is that true . Operability matters. It is also true that in a dangerous world where you have malicious hackers, System Integrity matters a ton. Finding the balance for both is the test. I will tell you, at least from this part of the day working on legislation that makes the penalties specific, high and enforceable against those that try to maliciously hacked automobiles is an aerial which i believe our jurisdiction is not only appropriate but our need for action is immediate. With mr. Nadlers permission yes. We have a history of driving open consensusbased standards that integrate security restrictions in the context of law. Mr. Shapiro, you argued for a market approach to addressing the security concerns raised by the internet of things. We all hoped that the market will punish bad actors. Isnt it important that the Government Creek rules on what is and is not permissible . It is important that Companies Know what is legal and not legal. There is something between the two, which is what is right for customers. We talk about the importance of trust for companies. Everyone wants privacy. Sometimes there are different ways in which it can go. We have lost records because of hipaa. If you put too much a line run privacy, you are trading off policies that we can design. Consumers should be able to make a reasoned decision about what they are willing to give up in exchange for privacy. I think this is premature for congress to say this is the line we are trying. Are drawing. There should be a National Consensus about what she be protected. Should there be at least notice to consumers . I think there should be notice. You do think the government should mandate notice . The ftc has significant jurisdiction in this area. If the law is unclear, which i do not believe it is yet. So the law is clear enough that the ftc should include a notice, and we leave it alone for the time being. They are provided sufficient guidance. I dont think there is a need yet. You are saying the ftc is handle it handling it so far. Before we close new services and new information, rather than a jump in, i think we should take a deep breath. Lets say that covers congress chooses to enact private security measures. In that case, are there any ways in which we should treat the internet of things differently from other companies that collect data . I would like to think about that answer and providedde it in writing. It allows us to collect data rapidly. Sometimes there is not permission. The niche it the internet allows Police Forces to monitor crowds in a public area. It allows them to monitor conversations, whether people are being angry or not in a public area. It provides an opportunity to have a video. There is a terminus opportunity here a tremendous opportunity here. In your testimony, your reference to Consumer Protection privacy principles. Can you briefly describe these principles . We provide heightened protection for things like biometrics. We think this works. This is enforceable by the ftc. We should be careful in the way we experience. The fundamental challenge i have is that the pace of regulation for outpaces pace of innovation for outpaces far outpaces regulation. Especially given what you just said, do you think the principles you have enumerated in the privacy principles should apply to all internet of things technology, or are the unique to the Automobile Industry . They are based on pretty generally accepted notions, but i think they are more broadly applicable anticipating i am testifying on behalf of the Auto Industry and reluctant to put my judgment on others. We are talking about the internet of things as if it is a single thing, but it is not. What are the privacy or security regimes we would have in place for a windshield wiper versus a wash that is monitoring you . The approach we are taking is one that works. In addition, we should not tomb this is the wild west and there is nobody out there monitoring today. The ftc has been engaged in this space and is taking action. I know you are out of time, but if the chairman will i want to point out something important in the health context. You are about to see significant and is the best actresses that rise up because ultimately what happened right now is we are not seeing the kind of growth a study came out that shows only 15 of doctors are talking about wearables to their patients. 50 of doctors think their patients with that if it from the use of those. Why the difference . Privacy. With an aging population that is concerned about how their information might be used for marketing or other purposes they hate those latenight telephone calls we are working very closely with a lot of folks to come up with industry best practices that gives some more bright lines trade we believe the ftc will be a good mechanism for those practices, but thats where we are today. Thank you very much. You did not even get to the question of what this the garbage men say to the garbage can say back. Im assuming it is, you stink. That is going to cost me. With that, we go to the gentleman from pennsylvania, mr. Marino, for his questions. Mr. Marino thank you, chairman. Mr. Garfield today it is estimated that the average home has 11 wifi devices during in my house with my tech savvy kids, it is triple that. I will give you an example. My children have a different taste in music than i do. This just happened last week. Im in the study, listening to this music, and the next thing i hear is captain john looked the cards johnluc picards voice saying, this does not compute. My son found a way to get into my system and switch the music i was playing compared to what he wants to play and tell me he did not like this music trade its fascinating what these kids can do with this equipment. Be that as it may it is an unprecedented boom the requires significantly more wireless spectrum. Could you expand on the implications of how this might impact the connection for can tumors as well as the overall growth of the sector of the economy . Your household sounds a lot like mine. I agree with what my colleagues have said about the need for more spectrum, whether wireless or wireline or license or unlicensed trade in this context, wireless is particularly important. Given the lack of optimization in the use of spectrum today and how much spectrum is held by the government, there is a significant opportunity both in the deployment of iot and economically as well to more efficiently use term and make more of it available. There is a huge opportunity there. The reality is that it is absolutely necessary. As we think about all of the physical world essentially being digitized, then the growth we have experienced in the use of spectrum will certainly explode great it is something we need to plan for, anticipate, and take action to deal with. Thank you. I have realized i can raise my garage door of an down from 2000 miles away, turn my lights on. But what is to prevent the hacker, the stateoftheart the stateoftheart thief from checking in on my software on my Computer System in my house, for example, when i go on vacation, i will turn the heat down. They could tap into my thermostat, read when the heat is reduced over a certain period of time, come to the Conclusion Even though there are lights going on and off all over the house that no one is there. And this is open to anyone. What is the industry doing to protect us from that . Thank you for your question and or your work on a lot of the encryption and privacy issues. Welcome to encryption. Encryption is a critical element of preventing that from happening. There are technological things you can do, man in the middle, etc. , but when you start getting above 256 bit encryption, 512 encryption it takes an enormous amount of power to break it. What the questions the consumer electronic side of the world as well as the Cloud Computing side of the world is looking at, is how do i put encryption into every device and make it so no one can mess with your life or more importantly, other things in your house that might have a direct impact on the evil living there. We need to make sure the government does not we can encryption. We need to continue to see the growth in the kinds of research around encryption that is some that in some cases supported by the government. Going back to the garage door opener, when it was first introduced, it was very primitive. It was fun to drive around the neighborhood and open other peoples garage doors great if you played it right, you could listen to other peoples phone conversations. As we have gotten more sophisticated, there are solutions and we dont even hear about those problems anymore. It has not been an issue. The reality is that significant investment is being made in innovating around privacy and purity, because it is the right thing to do and consumers are demanding it. It is plain sin part the shift you have seen that mr. Gary, gary mr. Shapiro, and mr. Reed have said. Can you block my son from changing my music . I can help you with that. [inaudible] [laughter] mr. Marino, did you get to your question of the launching of your trade secrets bill today . [inaudible] you didnt . Ok. Mr. Collins will be announcing it. Hopefully you will get to talk on that next. Did i mention there will be an announcement on the trade secrets bill today . Did anyone not here that . Thank you very we now go to the gentlelady from california, ms. Chu. Ms. Chu i recently read an article about two researchers who were able to hack into a jeep cherokee, first taking control of the Entertainment System and windshield wipers and then disabling the accelerator. They were able to slow down the car to stop on a busy highway. This experience reminds us that connectedness close in both direction and hackers could actually manipulate these devices for evil if they so chose. What specific best practices does the industry have in place to ensure that Something Like this does not come about and how our automobiles being designed to prevent exactly this from happening and what role do you see the federal government playing in this scenario . And i have five minutes . Great question. The gpack a week or two ago receives enormous national attention. Im struck here about the need to both take the threat very seriously, but also not to get caught up in the sensationalism that sometimes a companys a story like this. Our companies are designing and building to meet security risks from the very start. They are working with government academia, third parties, security technologists to address the hack risk. The hack risk is real and palpable and we need to address it. We have also formed and isac. It is a mechanism for the industry to voluntarily share risk and how to address those risks. There is a mechanism information in formation specifically for this challenge. The risk from a governmental side is the one we touched on before, how heavy a touch should there be . A world in which innovations happen so rapidly, how do you make it work so it is not rigid . That is the challenge. When you have done thus far is to facilitate sharing of risk threats and that is great and we hope that moves forward. Mr. Garfield, you stated that connectivity and communications between vehicles must be secure and reliable, especially for safety applications. That is something that congress the department of transportation, the federal trade commission and other stakeholders should oversee to protect consumers. You are referring to the consumer pass physical safety. When it comes to privacy and Data Security, you urge the federal government to essentially take a waitandsee approach and asking that we should only step in if the industry fails at selfgovernance. What in your mind is the difference between these two kinds of safety that would warrant such a divergent approach . Two points. Our suggestion is not that the government do nothing. Our suggestion is the government exercise restraint in that the approach that has been taken today on privacy that is sick too early sectorally driven, monitoring and enforcement by the ftc is working. In the first instance there is a significant market failure that may not be being met. Immediate action is clear. In the second instance it is less clear. The third and final point is the point we have all made about the innovation that is taking place in this space, not only around iot, but around ensuring we are driving privacy and security by design at the very beginning of these processes is actually making significant headway, and we worry about the unintended consequences of legislation at this stage. Ms. Chu mr. Shapiro, you ignore several concerns about privacy acknowledge several concerns about privacy. How do we rely on the industry to self govern and avoid the problems implicit in the fox guarding of the henhouse . I asked the question particularly in the context of one concern you raised, which is who owns the data from these devices . Isnt the industry incentivized to claim ownership over the data . It is true that a lot is going on vertically. We have our own wireless had Company Group focusing on creating rules everyone can live by, in part because its the right thing to do and in part because congress there are already Free Market Solutions which are happening quick he. Quickly. In the automobile, hundreds of thousands if not millions of consumers are already choosing to give up their data to Insurance Companies in exchange for a lower insurance rates. The Insurance Companies are monitoring how fast they drive because the consumers feel it is valuable to give up that information. That is informed consent. It is a free market decision. There are Solutions Coming up for parents, if they want to give the kid the keys to the car, they have the ability to monitor their children. My point was that this is not a legitimate it is not a legitimate area for government conversation. There is so much happening from an Innovation Point of view there are Different Directions we can go in. If industry goes in the wrong direction, we are fully confident. Even in the distracted driving area, where the federal government stepped in and said to industry, you should do everything you can to ban a driver from using any product in that driver seat, there are at least 80 Different Solutions and more developing every day which basically cut down on distracted driving through monitoring lanes, monitoring heads falling asleep watching your eyes, or Even Technology produced locally which monitors your cell phone as a driver and figures out if youre not paying attention to the road. With the gentlelady yield for a followup session . Ms. Chu certainly. Ms. Chus question was, who owns the data. Wouldnt you agree that data that comes from an individual inherently government does have a role in defining what rights they have to retain, protect, or retrieve their own personally identifiable data . That was your question, wasnt it . Ms. Chu thats right. Then i blew the answer. Obviously a consumer that creates data should have some rights in that data. The question is the Service Provider, if they own data. This goes into a lot of the areas of the internet, to not just the internet of things. What is the tradeoff that is involved . It is fair to say there should be transparency as to who is using the data, as to who owns it and can retain it. I would say that depends on the level of personal information in the data. Whether or not you are using your windshield wipers, for example, is the type of data that can easily be collected and shared, provide information on where it is raining without a lot of consumers saying, that is fine. As opposed to something more personal when you get into the health sphere, when you should determine what happens with your data. Thank you. I believe that will start a dialogue that will continue. The gentleman from texas. Thank you, chairman. Gentlemen, thank you for being here. I will try to break this down and keep it very simple. The issue is privacy. The time of the dick tracy watch is here. Our gentleman here has two dick tracy watches. I dont even wear a watch for it will help you in the answers, i hope. What time is it . [laughter] its up there. I cant even see the clock. Anyway the data that is stored is stored by a provider. It is information about an individual. The privacy of that individual is paramount to me, and i think the law, the constitution, the right of vivus c. It has to be protected by congress because it is a constitutional rights, privacy. Congress needs to set the expectation of tribes see for individuals that have shared their information with different entities. Im concerned about the privacy of the individual two ways. One, the provider or Service Provider sharing it with other nongovernment agencies. And the Service Provider providing that information to the government. Especially the government. We should up date the law which right now, information stored on the cloud for six months is private. Six months and one day, the government can have it. Theres no expectation of vivus c. Absurd protection of the constitutional right of privacy. I do not think we should leave it up to the ftc to set the guidelines or the fcc or any other Government Agency to determine what the right of vivus he should be. Privacy should be. Should not we in Congress Update the law to provide whatever rules we think should be provided so that citizens know that the government to get this information you can use geolocation and all other information has got to have a search warrant based on the Fourth Amendment before they can order you to give the government that information about a citizen out there in the fruited plain. Should we be proactive to do that . Are you recommending that we wait for all these Different Things to happen out there, and try to solve them, get the lawyers to sue and all these things, or should congress be proactive . I have been working on this for years and we have not been able to get anywhere. Should not we do that, congress do that . Its like a yes or no answer. I wanted to say amen. The reality of the situation is yes, reform is essential. This is something the committee has to do. Congressman marino was here. We absolutely need these kinds of legislation to move forward so we know what we can tell our customers what i will protect, how i will protect it, and when i will be forced to share it. A person may not be a customer for this reason. This is wonderful, but i dont want the government getting it. Right now you are saying, maybe they can have it, maybe they cant have it. Amen here on the right. We support reform. The government is saying we have been burned as an industry. Europe and other countries are using the fact that our nation is at a disadvantage now to say Cloud Services and things like that should not be based in the United States. They are not secure, government can take the information. It has been very harmful to the u. S. Technology industry and it has been used against us. Under the Fourth Amendment, it is about as clear a constitution as you can get about the government must have ecpa needs an update. I think it is a much more complex discussion. The reasonable expectation of privacy is set by the supreme court. It changes with technology. Your reasonable expectation of ribas he in some data if you are out in public is not the same as perhaps other data. It goes into whether you voluntarily give that information to another person. Im interested about the government the federal government, state government, local government, which all right now can see that information in the cloud without a warrant and the person involved does not have notice about it. Amen on the government side. This is on the nongovernmental side. Data is necessary to provide services that consumers want. Whether it is the insurance example we plugin i am one of those consumers. I know exactly how my kids strive to get a report every month from the Insurance Company that tells me how fast they are braking. As a parent that is a useful thing and a disincentive for them to drive poorly. I yield back to the chairman. Thank you, gentlemen. We go to the gentlelady from washington, first district. Thanks all of you for being here. I want to followup on the Electronic Communications privacy act conversation here. Myself and congressman co. The congressmen when we talk about issues of making sure there is a Legal Framework to protect information and so consumers feel like they understand what is happening with their information and Law Enforcement is clear on how they would access information what do you think about extending that to include geolocation and the International Issues we face in terms of access to information . Anyone . I guess i will start with mr. Reid mr. Reed. Thank you for your introduction. Its a valuable thing to figure out how we move forward to we are all americans here. One of the things to realize from my numbers is just how much our opportunities are overseas. When the issues you raise about u. S. Government access to that data start harming our sales, it hurts jobs in the United States. Youre precisely right this is an Issue Congress has to step in on. The question of geolocation is something we will have to work both with you and Law Enforcement has Law Enforcement does have a duty to work and protect the citizenry. The problem comes when i have to tell a customer i dont know about the answer to the question of when i have to hand over that information. The difference between the six circuit and the ninth circuit and this idea that i have to tell my customer i dont know is enormous. I think the other element that should be raised on this is how other countries look at what is happening. If the United States government says, we have access to any cloud data at any time in any way we please regardless of where the data is stored or who is on, we have to expect that russia will want the same privileges from our companies. That china will want the same privileges for our companies. Legislation like what you are proposing is what we need, because we need to have a strong stance that we can look at those countries and say no, i will not hand over that information without some better legal authority. Thank you very much. Mr. Garfield . Mr. Garfield your question gives us a chance to raise Something Congress can do in this area, which is eagle redress legal redress. His committee and congress generally has the opportunity to do something. That is another step that can be taken that would help internationally. You were earlier talking about encryption and we have been having a conversation about whether there should be a backdoor for Law Enforcement access to encrypted data and whether that should be mandated. If such a policy were mandated by the federal government, what with the impact be specifically on user data and what you think the impact would be for your customers . The impact would be negative here and internationally for a host of reasons. Its important to keep in mind that security is a part of advancing privacy. If you create any kind of door, it wont only be used by those who you intended to be used by. In many respects, you create a pandoras box of challenges that would be highly problematic for both privacy and security interests and as something that should not be done. We worked in the Recording Industry years ago and one of the things we realized was rather than fighting technology, the best solution is deploying the use of technology. I would suggest for the federal agencies in this context those answers may hold some merit in this context as well. We learn hard lessons. I feeling we have a bit of deja vu right now with the clipper we are facing. The reality is over 40 leading Security Experts have said the idea of the government mandating or creating a front door into our devices in our systems is an anathema to the idea that we want to create my tell your customers and users that we have secure systems. We have done this dancer for, it was already figured out to be a mistake. Im disappointed we are having to revisit again when we know the answer, and that is into an encryption with as few openings as possible as the best solution we can provide to all citizens in every country. Rep. Delbene we have legislation to prevent their past to prevent to prevent their for being such a backdoor, mr. Shapiro did you want to add something . Mr. Shapiro we also provides with Law Enforcement with their trying to do. Its a difficult question, not a black and white. I think history is shown the given government a backdoor is not the best approach as technologies evolve quickly. On the other hand, as americans, when a super crisis evolves, you will see Companies Step up and try to help the government. I think we sought in boston in the bombing, where Technology Companies worked very closely to try and find out who it was the did this dastardly act. I think we have to recognize there is some flexibility that does not require an act of congress to say there must be a back door. If there is a back door everyone must have it it gets the Technology Industry very uncomfortable, but the consumers very comfortable. Rep. Delbene i yield back. Rep. Issa with that we go to the gentleman from georgia. Rep. Johnson mr. Garfield, your testimony represented the desire of the industry to be free from new Regulation Without becoming a wild west of privacy. Earlier this year the federal trade commission reinforced this message in its staff report on the internet of things, where recommended among other things that companies build privacy and security into the designs of their connected devices. Last congress i introduced an act that is a commonsense approach to an urgent problem that would protect consumers without disrupting functionality or innovation through a safe harbor and other mechanisms to promote trust through selfregulation. I view this legislation is reinforcing of the ftc staff recommendations on privacy and security for connected devices and i plan to reintroduce the act during this current session of congress. Privacy is an issue that should unite us, not drive us apart. In an always on ecosystem, where over 25 billion connected devices store and transmit information about consumers, it is time that we had some rules of the road. What steps will private industry take to Keep Congress informed and address legislative concerns involving security and privacy of these emerging technologies . Thank you for your question. The point you made at the beginning about the recommendations, particularly around privacy and security of design is occurring. The industry is spending billions to invest in innovative mr. Garfield and innovate around privacy and security, in part because its the right thing to do, but also because consumers are demanding it. As well, we are advancing sector specific principles around privacy and security as well. There is much action happening right now in this space, and we are committed to making sure that congress is fully aware of the steps that the private sector is making to advance those issues. It is in our business interest to be aligned with both you and consumer interest around these issues. Rep. Johnson thank you. I want to focus on the version of your testimony regarding advanced driver assistance systems. I understand the benefits you are explaining about the systems, the sensors that provide braking assist and Adaptive Cruise control. I understand newer software will go far beyond just those actions. My concern revolves around the encryption of this technology. If these systems are being operated on a broad range of Wireless Committee case and technologies between vehicles, how are these frequencies being protected . Mr. Bainwol i will give you an answer and come back to you with a vetted engineers answer. Based on the src dsrc, a technology that was built for the purposes of communications between vehicles and i will come back to again with specifics of the security this embedded in that. We are obviously not a point of full deployment, this is being tested. There has been an expansive test out of ann arbor over the last couple of years, has been tested abroad. The fundamental point i would make is that the benefit stream here, if you do a costbenefit analysis, the benefit stream is enormous. Yes, weve got to address the cyber risk and security risk. They are being dealt with from the design phase on the. On up. But in terms of the security embedded, i will not back to. Rep. Johnson if endtoend encryption is being utilized how will Law Enforcement access that information . Mr. Bainwol we require a warrant of some sort. This is again the point that mr. Poe was making. We are very careful in our principles, particularly very specifically of the information will not be shared with entities unless there is a compelling specific reason. Rep. Johnson there would be an ability to counter the encryption . Kind of a backdoor if you will for lack of a better mr. Bainwol im not an engineer, this is his own that i zone that i am not going to have a great specific answer for. Rep. Johnson i yield back. Rep. Issa i want to talk about something for more than a little complex and then make it simple. In the aviation space, Collision Avoidance has been around for a while. It started with aircraft and has come down. One of the technologies is in fact mandated now in just a few years for all aircraft. It is a cute name, ive said it forever, but not have to say it , it is Automatic Dependent Surveillance broadcast. Adsb. It says in short here is where i am and sends it out to everybody, the faa regulates it, other aircraft are sending out where they are, receive where you are, it makes for a very exact gpsbased within a few feet of knowing exactly where you are and of course, which we way you are going, and how fast. Making a collision almost an impossible thing to do if you are simply monitoring the product which has alerts. The question, i want to make sure i ask it, when the faa, having jurisdiction over this, they made a decision that only those who send out a signal can in fact receive a signal. So today, systems that cost anywhere from 6,000 at the very low end to hundreds of thousands of dollars equipped aircraft they communicate by sending out and receiving information where others are. Mobile devices, devices that could be bought for matter of a few hundred dollars that only receive are blocked from assuming that information. Receiving that information. When you roll out a new technology and clearly these kinds of technology are what big auto was looking at rolling out, countless automobiles will not be equipped with those systems for decades to come. The 65 mustang or any other classic cars that congressman ron vargas has will not ever be equipped with them. Can you comment on the need to make sure that any standard allows for aftermarket retrofitting of products that to the greatest extent possible enjoy the benefits of Newer Technology brought to market in new automobiles . Mr. Bainwol there is a challenge in the auto space with fleet penetration. The average age of an auto was 11 years old. New Technology Takes a long time to wind its way through. Rep. Issa now with aftermarket not with aftermarket products. Mr. Bainwol it took 30 years to go from introduction to 95 penetration. In the case of these technologies that offer such value to society, i think you raise a legitimate point that we have to find a way to fill the gap. The truth of the matter is, in part the gap is filled with the phone that gary pedals. Just to give an example rep. Issa a match or gary wants im not sure that gary wants to be called a peddler. Mr. Bainwol waze is crowd sourced based, and it provides many of the benefits without the same absolute standard of certainty. We have got to find a way to fulfill the marketplace and i think the apple world does a good job of bridging that. And then ultimately to fill the fleet. I think your point is a valid one in we got to find a way to make it work. Rep. Issa mr. Shapiro, the question more was, as new innovative items come out of the oem market and new fleet, and theres an ability to get perhaps some but not all of those benefits, government, at least in the case of aviation has blocked the ability of thousands of small pilots, pilots with a piper cub made before you and i were born, in which a mobile device can be put on board. Today they are blocked from knowing there is a fast we were mover headed towards them because the faa saw fit to block it unless you are sending a signal. Thats really the question of enabling as much benefit from potentially lowcost handheld devices. Mr. Shapiro as a member of the flying public, i never quite understood the decision and i i am glad it is being rectified. Rep. Issa all aircraft in a matter of a few years will have ads out. Today can carry a few hundred dollars product and it can roll out to receive the signal. They would be part of knowing where a fast mover is at avoiding it even if they are not putting up that signal. Mr. Shapiro i am thrilled to hear you are focusing on it. I fly almost every day. The reason i have been so excited for years about Driverless Cars is that the level of the death and injury caused by cars is huge. It can be avoided. We are on the verge of this technology in several Car Companies have proved it. It would be a tragedy if it were delayed in any way because an aftermarket was not allowed to develop to move along. I think you are absolutely correct in indicating that we will get there in two different ways. One the Car Manufacturers themselves will do everything they can to get this technology in the public hands. Along the way, as weve seen with almost every other Automotive Technology including car security, the aftermarket is quicker and can get greater penetration and provide competition. My concerns about some of the privacy discussions are when it comes to matters of losing your limit losing your life, which is what we are talking about with collisions in cars, its a little less important to have privacy that it is in some other areas. The privacy discussion is important, i dont want to denigrate it. But when it comes to our own physical safety, it takes a backseat. Rep. Issa the two of you did take a picture of you early standing next to each other smiling. Mr. Bainwol this is not to contradict, but just to clarify. Gary used the words about fatalities in cars as of cars are killing people. I want to clarify that 95 maybe 98 or 99 of the fatalities on the roads are result of environmental challenges and human error. The car itself worked rather beautifully. And the critical point that we would both embrace rep. Issa i think he was talking about antilock breaks traction control, all the items that come out that have reduced the death rate in all too flawed drivers. Mr. Bainwol we are very proud of those technologies, we want to see the move into the fleet as soon as possible. Those technologies are the answer to human error, which is a huge problem. Rep. Issa mr. Reed, said you since you were given credit for development of apps, your members wanting to be able to develop apps depend on either an open standard or, in the alternative, being able to come if you will, hack it able to hack in order to create interfaces because otherwise you are locked out of interfaces with the automobile and other products. Mr. Reed it will end up with published standards and when i what i believe will be interfaces where i wont have to hack it, there is a connotation to hack which is a little on. Odd. What will end up happening is that they will be published by the Car Manufacturers that will allow me to tie into the existing structure. Or it will do to the phone i do it to the phone and i will have a secure, safe api platform that i can build up the apps on. Im quite hopeful about the connected car. They got the place were you will see an explosion of apps that will be really helpful and beneficial, especially those with less kids in the back seat. Little kids in the back seat. Rep. Issa i mentioned that we do not have in this committee the jurisdiction over the bandwidth necessary for many of your products. We do, however, have a mandated seat at the table and consultation with the ways and Means Committee and with the administration in trade. Under trade Promotion Authority for both the european trade and the pacific. I would like any of you that want to comment on the importance of Global Standards getting the internet of things to in fact be embraced in a way around the world that allows either for economy of scale or consistency of service and i will go right on the line on that. Mr. Shapiro. Mr. Shapiro global stators are nice but not essential. We have Seen Technology that politico and ego often plays to whose country standards, there are several. Rep. Issa i was also talking of the access, the trade promotion is intended to have her in the acceptance without terror for barrier of american roddicks. Barrier of american products. Mr. Shapiro standard is one issue, and trade promotion is good. We are very excited with the direction things are taken in the last month during its positive, obviously to the extent that these devices get out there and they are improving peoples lives in saving lives, its an important thing. Theres an international approach, thats always preferred to one thats country by country high tariff. Mr. Garfield i think the opportunity that you highlighted that trade agreements provide for driving global consensusbased standards that help to advance scalability and interoperability are net positive. Hence our strong support for trade Promotion Authority and ultimately the trade deals that will emanate as a result of that. Mr. Bainwol its complicated. Trade gets tricky. The notion of harmonization is valid. Its been around for 100 years as a concept. We are building a different standard all around the globe, and that ends up upping the cost of products for consumers all over, a new car is safer than an old car, if we reduce the cost of product of harmonization we get more people into newer cars and that is safer and good for everybody. Mr. Reed we see 20 of apps and in china are actually from u. S. Companies, which is huge if you look at the china market its hard. That leads me to the second part. Our one concern about standards is that we are fighting some finding some countries are dipping their talent to the idea of creating domestic open standards that are slightly tweaked from the United States these are stripped the barriers strictly barriers that they are putting up to protect domestic manufacturers, domestic app developers. We have seen it in the wifi space around the globe, we are seeing tweaks to standards to protect domestic production. We would support your perspective on improving trade and improving the standard so they are available to all. Rep. Issa on that note, with no further questions, this will conclude todays hearing. I want to thank all our witnesses, without objection members will have five legislative days to submit additional questions for witnesses and additional material for the record, that also leaves witnesses five days, if you could please, to provide additional material including that which some of you promised to give to our members. With that, we stand adjourned. [captions Copyright National cable satellite corp. 2015] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. Visit ncicap. Org] the cspan cities tour thats visit countries visits cities across the country. We will end more about augusta georgia. At the age of 19, he was awarded the medal of honor. We are sitting here in the Augustine Museum and 10 years ago a decision was made to do a military display to honor jimmy dyess. When i did my research, i went through recipients of the last hundred years. The medal of honor recipients cents the civil war, he is the only person to have earned both awards. He would say that he did not deserve it. He would point out somebody else it was more heroic. He was humble. He never talked about the Carnegie Medal. I interviewed people who knew him when i did the book. People knew him well. I told them, tell me about the Carnegie Medal that he earned. And they knew nothing about it. I knew about it. Most of those who receive these metals will say they didnt deserve it. I think that he would of been in that category. We also visit the boyhood home of woodrow wilson. President wilson moved to the best as a child, one years old. He lived in another house and then moved to this house when he was three. President wilsons very first memory was in november 1860 him up before he was four years old. He was standing in front of the house and two men came in a hurry and they said, Abraham Lincoln has been elect did elected president and there will be a war. Young tommy ran inside and asked his father what was war. Why were they so excited . We think it is remarkable that his first memory is about another president and in other in other war. See all of our programs from augustine throughout the day, on cspan twos on