to borrow on a credit card. >> it's insane. >> no, i'm saying i want the right to use my credit card without having to pay for the fees for the industry, that the industry-- and instead of charging more to use credit cards why don't they do this: charge less to people using cash. that's all-- >> all of you guys are saying, you're saying it's a good idea that maybe people could be paying 4% extra this weekend just to use their credit card? >> i don't think it's a good idea, but i think what will happen, competition will eat away at it. >> from your lips to god's ears. >> and everybody will say it won't happen. >> and adam, we keep hearing about the new great rules and regulations that are going to make things easier, it feels like life gets more expensive all the time particularly for people who have no choice, but to use their credit card. >> well, i'm not sure who that is, this is a merchant issue not a consumer issue. no one is forcing you to use a credit card. no one is forcing-- >> the consumer paying 4% extra, this mass nothing to do