conversationsing central around the response to a tragedy. but why an officer can kill black people around the country, right? >> if you want to say excessive force is wrong and violence is wrong. you don't want to be the problem you're trying to expose. >> what's happening, was happening a lot what i see especially in ferguson, is it's almost as if i hit you, but the cameras ohm come on when you hit me back, right? that's what's been happening in ferguson. i was there early when a lot of the protests were simply people just wanting to express their moral outrage and kind of also come together to mourn and cops showed up in riot gear and shields, so you're telling me before you say any words, that you already think that i'm going to be violent. that is provocation, right? >> that's a problematic dynamic. we've seen play out. hopefully we start moving towards the progress part of this conversation. that's why we're here. cherelle, carmen, michael, thank