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Journalists, security, military leaders, their families, and now Stephen Miller. Then 28 days, Cornell Belcher on how to read new polling showing biden way ahead. Four weeks to november 3rd. And the vp debate. Why there will be a plexiglass divider between the head of the Coronavirus Task force and Kamala Harris tomorrow night. When all in starts right now. Good evening from new york. Im chris hayes. Over the last five days from when the president first announced he had covid to when he was hospitalized at walter reed, scarily, with what appears to be a severe case, returned to the white house despite still being infected and likely contagious and then took off his mask and entered the building. Every single venal pathology of this president , this administration and the party that supports him that have led to one of the worst responses in the world and the deaths of more than 211,000 americans and counting, all of them have been on display. The denials and the shiftiness and the lies, the propping and the narcissism, the disinformation and misinformation and miscommunication. The subsuming everything to the president s narrow sense oft will play best politically. The contempt for safety precautions and Public Health expertise, but more than anything else, its the recklessness. A recklessness so egregious and aggressive and acute as to only be described as evil. But we know we dont know the full story, is that someone in the president s inner circle tested positive for covid on thursday. The president then went to a lunch buffet fundraiser, potentially infecting all kinds of other people, including the attendees and the staff of his own resort. New jersey officials have been frantically working to contact the guests and try to control the spread. And then during the president s hospitalization for the coronavirus, he insisted on a joyride for pure propping and ego purposes, locking secret Service Agents into a hermetically sealed car with him despite his ongoing sickness. And then he returned to the white house still sick where he theatrically took off his mask and entered the building to infect ian mo infect even more people. This behavior which reflects the attitude he and the white house have been taking for four months now. I mean, honestly, since the beginning of the pandemic, has produced an outbreak in the white house with more confirmed cases than there are in entire countries right now. Just a short time ago a Senior Administration official told nbc news that Senior Adviser to the president Stephen Miller has now tested positive and is in community. Consider the sheer size of the cluster that miller is now part of. At least 25 people, among them the president , his wife, hope hicks, Stephen Miller, Trumps Campaign manager, a number of republican senators, chris christie, Kellyanne Conway and her daughter claudia, Kayleigh Mcenany and at least four press staffers, people that work for her, at least three white house reporters who have to go and interact with them as they bark at them without mask, including michael sheer of the New York Times whose wife now has been infected. Thats not to mention trumps personal valet, a coast guard admiral whose infection prompted the joint chiefs to quarantine. That is what this white houses cavalier attitude toward the white house has wrought. And these are only the people weve been able to publicly identify, often through diligent reporting. The administration is not doing it themselves. No, they are not Contact Tracing, despite the cdc standing by to do so. They are not even contacting people who they know have been exposed. All of that would seem to be in furtherance of a coverup of the magnitude of their stupidity and incompetence and cruelty, even if the coverup now further inperils peoples health. Meanwhile, the person running against trump has taken the opposi opposite tact. Joe biden at a speech today in gettysburg pennsylvania lets end the politics and follow the science. Wearing a mask wearing a mask is not a political statement, its a scientific recommendation. Social distancing isnt a political statement. Its a scientific recommendation. Testing, tracing, the development and all of the approval and distribution of a vaccine isnt a political statement, it is a sciencebased decision. It would be one thing if the president was just being personally irresponsible. Still awful. Still putting people around him at terrible risk. But at least that would be somewhat contained, i suppose. But, no, after getting the best health care taxpayer dollars can buy, a fourroom suite at walter reed, a medevac. Hes the president. That comes with the territory. A team of doctors monitoring every up and down and setting up ways to treat him back at home, he comes back to tell everyone not to worry about covid, indeed, to basically pitch it as if hes hocking a vitamin supplement. Youre going to beat it. I didnt feel so good. Two days ago i felt great, like better than i have in a long time. I said just recently, better than 20 years ago. Thats the kind of message that will get people sick. And when people get sick they die. Statements like that dont just encourage people not to worry about a virus that might very well kill them, particularly if they are in his age group, they devalue and denigrate the loss of so many of our fellow americans to this virus. After trump tweeted something similar yesterday, telling people not to be afraid of the disease, no big deal, u. S. Olympic runner responded, as my grandfather lies in a bed struggling to take his last breaths due to covid, im not sure ive ever read anything more offensive or tone deaf in my life. We lost an average of more than 700 americans every day to the virus over just the past week, seven months into this. Over the course of this pandemic, thousands of americans have died alone at home because the hospitals were so overrun they stayed home until it was too late. And then some were found by family members or concerned neighbors. There are hospitals as i speak to you right now that are at capacity in wisconsin, which has an outbreak, right now, and yet this president who got the best care in the world on the public dollar that he paid all of 750 in taxes for has the gall to tell the rest of us not to worry. Im joined now by democratic senator brian schatz of hawaii. Sent a letter to the white house chief of staff requesting the white house immediately conduct Contact Tracing and testing of resident staff, including housekeepers, food service and maintenance staff. Senator, maybe we start there. I mean, there are so many people that work in that white house complex who are not famous and they are not powerful and they are not close to the president who have been forced to toil in an unsafe workplace not that different from a meatpacking plant. Yeah, and i think whats first of all, theyre not going to start Contact Tracing. And whats crazy to me about this, this particular issue, is Contact Tracing actually is hard. Weve had some difficulty in the state of hawaii getting it operationalized. They dont have that problem. They had the cdc standing by. You could immediately get an army of contact tracers. And so whats really going on is they dont want to know who else they infected. But for me, the way this is different is that so much of the president s cruelty over the last four years has been, unfortunately, intermediated by politics or the media or peoples personal ideology, and whats different, i think, from the standpoint of people observing it is that this is personal cruelty. This is a person who is sick infecting others physically adjacent to him because he needs to fill the hole in his soul. It doesnt even make political sense for him. So you get a window into his pathology, his endless need for attention aadlation. This is a little different to observe. It may not be different in terms of its origin, but it is different to observe a man who actually doesnt even care about the people who work right next to him. I think of george w. Bush and ronald reagan, president s with whom ive disagreed on everything, but even those president s would have been at least nice to their staff. Would have not wanted to infect the people close to them. And this president is uniquely awful in that way as a human being. Whats more troubling to me, i mean, and all of that is true and its also theres a connection between what happened in the white house and the country. I mean, theyre the same story. Everything theyve done in the country, theyve done in the white house. Why would it be any different . But whats more trouble toimg are your colleagues like senator kennedy of louisiana. Senator kennedy, you know, hes not an idiot. Hes a quite smart guy. Hes impressive in his own right. Hes not, like, some anomalous crazy character, you know, with the psychology of donald trump. Hes a, you know, republican senator. Hes out there the next day saying, actually, it turns out the virus is not as deadly as we thought. Ron johnson talking about how hes going to, you know, do whatever it takes to go vote for Amy Coney Barrett. Like, no matter what he does, they are with him and that is the pathology that, to me, its both incomprehensible and also unforgiveable. Youre right. Because, you know, as as a now wellknown political pundit and writer said, everything trump touches dies. You see a person a physician with a reasonably good reputation coming in ruined. By being close to the president. Yeah. And you see these members of the United States senate on the republican side who will absolutely and do quietly talk about how insane the president is and how theyre just trying to manage this situation, and yet when it comes down to it, they stand absolutely with him. All the way to the bitter end. And we are pretty close to the bitter end. The fact that the president has withdrawn from covid relief negotiations in favor of installing a Supreme Court justice in order to take away health care six days after the election, like, im not expecting them to be liberal. Im not expecting them even to be decent, but i am a little puzzled at why they are so insistent at going down with the ship. And some of these people i know, youre right, theyre bright, and theyre pretty good politicians other than the fact that they are clearly under his spell. So its not just enough to beat trump, we have to repudiate trumpism. The president tweeted out this this announcement that he personally was killing the stimulus talks. Because he doesnt want crimeinfected democrat cities to get any money, as if they are not americans. Of course the the rescue money on the table, which is for state municipal governments, would go to everyone, not just democrats. This this the markets tanked. Everyone i know who follows this is destory about this. There is unbelievable suffering in the country and hes choosing to be hoover at a time of crisis similar to the Great Depression and announcing it. Yeah, i think we can abandon the supposition that hes secretly a political genius. He is absolutely ruining his electoral chances by pulling out of covid relief talks. And because were democrats and were actually we care and were desperately trying to help the people that we represent, we were willing to give him a 2 or 3 trillion lifeline into the economy two weeks out, three weeks out from the election, and you can make an argument that that wasnt in our political interests, but because we represent the people, because we see the desperation, we were willing to do the right thing and compromise with this president , with whom we disagree so vehemently, and yet he decided to pull out of these talks. So my view at this point is the only way were going to get covid relief, the only way were going to protect your health care, the only way were going to get any kind of sane Covid Response is when not just trump but trumpism, especially as its manifested in the United States senate, is repudiated across the board on november 4th. All right. Senator brian schatz who is there in his home state of hawaii far, far, far from the white house, which is probably a good idea. Thank you for your time tonight. Thank you. For some historical perspective, i want to turn now to nbc news and msnbc president ial historian michael beschloss. Thanks. President s have been, you know, president s have been ill before and theyve tried to cover up their illness. True. Thats actually kind of a through line in american history, but i dont think i can conceive of a personal close proximity to management failure that so closely mirrors a larger policy failure in the history of the american state. Yeah, you know, Woodrow Wilson got the flu in 1919 and he was responsible for the influenza pandemic of 1918 1919 in the United States. It killed 675,000 americans and wilson was their executioner. His secretary got it. His daughter got it. His secret service got it. The tragic park was soldiers he had been shipping off to europe got it on these ships that were called coffin ships. Military officers and doctors begged him not to send these soldiers on to those ships because they knew that they would die of this plague. He sent them anyway. And the result was that wilson never for the entire duration of his pandemic ever once gave a single Public Statement to americans that this was happening, never once told them how to protect themselves, and never apologized for it. You know, this is one of the big negative lessons in history i never thought i would see this happen again, but it looks as if its happening once again and has been almost biblically the last six or seven months. The president seems intent and his party seems intent now on essentially telling people theyre not seeing what theyre seeing. I mean, im right. The hoover comparison, to me, is really the only one when you think about a, you know you know the that were going to right around the corner and americans are were coming back and the idea that hoovers sort of epitaph will forever be that he failed to grapple with the magnitude of the problem and he was ushered out of office in an historic drubbing because of that. Its hard to find any precedent other than that 32 incumbent massively screwing up a response to a National Crisis that resembles anything weve seen in the last seven months or last five days. Right. And trump is so terrible he makes hoover look like gandhi. Hoover was someone with empathy. He had done a lot to get food to people at the time of world war i and he was actually considered a pretty progressive republican. In Donald Trumps case, why did he cut off those negotiations today . The nice explanation is he did it because he wants to be able to blame it on democrats in congress. The not nice explanation is a lot uglier, which is that tyrants through history when theyre turned out by the people, they say if im not going to be the leader, let them suffer. Right. Sampson pulling down the temple. There is a real question, too, about president s condition and what the implications of that are. Im sitting here thinking were watching the president tweet. Those tweets are official statements. If the president were to tweet an announcement we were moving naval ships into the South China Sea or some aggressive military action against some state, that would be read as a president. I dont know, is the president actually tweeting . Is someone tweeting for him . Is he of sound mind right now . We have no idea. Seems pressing and relevant. And we have all to sleep, i think, for the next four weeks at least with one eye open because we dont know. Assuming that this debate comes off with joe biden, number one, you know, why in hell are they going to be in the same studio . Cant this be done virtually . The third Kennedy Nixon debate was done with kennedy new york, nixon in los angeles. Wow. The technology is a lot better now. Instead, were talking about all the people in that studio taking the risk of being around donald trump, the members of his entourage. You know, its a Health Hazard to everyone and its completely unnecessary. But as we watch his performance, were all going to have to ask the question, is he on drugs . Has he been reduced by illness so that he cannot function at president , not only for the next four years but during the next several weeks . That that point about Kennedy Nixon just blew my mind. I had no idea that was the case. Sure. We should say Vice President joe biden today was asked about this and basically said, look, were going to follow the cdc guidelines and precautions here. Right. But basically said if he still has covid we probably shouldnt debate in the same room. Seems sensible. There is no reason on earth for these guys to be in the same room. Joe biden is 77 years old. He narrowly escaped getting infected by the president of the United States a week ago. And thank god he didnt. Michael beschloss, always great to have to you. Same here. Thank you so much for your time. Four more weeks, chris. Thank you. All right. Up next, trump aide Stephen Miller to the ever growing coronavirus cluster as the administration deliberately does little to help. White house reporter olivia nuzzi with the view from the inside next. With my hepatitis c. I felt i couldnt be at my. Best for my family. In only 8 weeks with mavyret. I was cured. I faced reminders of my hep c every day. I worried about my hep c. But in only 8 weeks with mavyret. I was cured. Mavyret is the only 8week cure for all types of hep c. Before starting mavyret your doctor will test. If youve had hepatitis b which may flare up and cause serious liver problems during and after treatment. 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There are at least 25 confirmed cases directly linked to the white house cluster, including, of course, the president and first lady, Senior Adviser Stephen Miller, just found out about him, three senators, a coast guard admiral, five members of the White House Press staff, at least three members of the White House Press corps, plus the wife of one of those journalists. And the white house is not tracing any of the contacts of guests and Staff Members at that now infamous rose garden event last week to celebrate Amy Coney Barrett. A potential superspreader situation where at least eight of those people, including the president , may have become infected. Of course there were indoor events afterwards as well. They have also not sought help from the centers for Disease Control and prevention for Contact Tracing despite the cdc having a team on stand by to assist. The governor of washington, d. C. And the mayor cant even connect to the president about the protocols for the ongoing outbreak at the president s residence. Zero guidance, zero, zilch, for three days after the president was diagnosed with covid. An email sent out on sunday instructed staff who exhibit symptoms to seek care from their primary care provider. The white house is the epicenter of a dangerous coronavirus cluster. It is insane he would return to the white house and jeopardize his Staffs Health when we are still learning about new cases among his staff. This place is a cesspool. For more, im joined by olivia nuzzi. Before we even get to the outbreak, i wonder if you could just describe what the attitude towards Safety Measures in that building and on that campus have been generally among the staff, the sort of laissezfairness. How do you yourself and reporters feel about that . We saw President Trump throughout the pandemic downplaying the reality that we were all experiencing. We saw members of his task force or Kayleigh Mcenany briefing reporters. You could see who was wearing a mask, who wasnt. And on the campaign trail, you know, ive been to events where its this strange situation. Most of the people who are there, the president s supporters, are not wearing face coverings, but lately you see campaign staff, advanced staff, they have face coverings on and theyre passing out face masks or hand sanitizer, but the person speaking, the president , and anyone who comes before him, members of congress, political candidates, they never do have they never have face coverings on. And obviously weve heard from President Trump for months and months downplaying the threat, saying things that make absolutely no sense and have no basis in reality about treatment. And so i guess its kind of mirrored, you know, what we have seen publicly. And ive been talking to people over the last several days who work in the white house who are very frustrated, who are concerned for their own health and safety, and as you said in your intro, they did not even receive any guidance about what to do if they were feeling ill until sunday, until three days after the public learned about the president s diagnosis. One thing thats been striking to me is the sort of idea in some of the reporting around the Amy Coney Barrett event and stuff that, like, a negative test has this talusmatich quality to it. I tested negative today. People being told after they got their rapid tests back, you tested negative, you can take your mask off. Actually, there are a lot of false negatives. We know that. Did you get a sense that the people there, like, thought, oh, were all getting tested, fine . Well, no, because even a few months back at the height of all of this, there were hundreds of thousands of people already dead, the white house wasnt even taking wasnt taking temperatures anymore when you would go there. So it seemed like as things started to open up again, there was kind of a similar sense in the white house right. That the threat was dying down and that basic precautions didnt need to be taken, and now obviously were seeing the result of that, which is a huge spike that makes it look like the white house itself is a hot spot for this virus. I keep thinking i mean, obviously, weve talked about people who have tested positive. Many of them are known, you know, the Campaign Manager and chris christie, but oeshls there is the valet who brings the president his food. There are house keepers. Who tested positive about two weeks ago. But there is all sorts of support staff there and then there are people like the goldstar families. This is blowing my mind. There was an event for goldstar families inside the white house the sunday, the day after the Amy Coney Barrett event. There you see it there. These are family members of those who have died wearing the uniform inside on a sunday when the day after that superspreader event where that flew from all over the country to be there and were exposed, one imagines, possibly, to the virus. Right. I mean, i think thats why it was always difficult to take the president seriously when people would want to give him credit when he would kind of stumble into saying the right thing about the virus. Right. Every once in a while. Because when we would see his actions or we would see what the white house is doing which is, you know, totally at odds with recommendations from his own medical his own doctors, his inexperts on his medical his medical advice and i think its just its just kind of a shitshow. I dont know if i can say that on this show, but that is kind of the language that most white house people i talk to are repeating to me. Everyone is as inevitable as this outcome was, i think people are still surprised that this is so on the nose. I guess the final question for you is, about the president s health and condition, which is who basically, who can we is there any reliable information about his condition on this point . It i mean, i think that the doctor sort of gave that away the first two days. Hes now in the white house and, like, we just dont know, like, is do you know . Does anyone know . No. Its terrifying that youre asking me. I have no idea. And people that i talk to in the white house say the same thing. You know, i asked a senior white house official over the weekend, can you even trust the people you work with to tell you the truth about their own health, right . Can you trust that other senior white house officials are telling you the truth about how they have tested. Right. Or that theyre going to reveal it in time if they test positive, that youre going to learn about it quickly enough for you to take some kind of action that might save you, and this person said, i cant, i cant trust them. Thats really as damning as it gets. Olivia nuzzi, who has been doing great reporting on all of this, thank you so much. Thanks. All right. Coming up, joe biden leading in double digits in the polls. Ill ask Cornell Belcher to explain what that growing lead really means, next. Smooth driving pays off with allstate, the safer you drive the more you save you never been in better hands allstate click or call for a quote today you never been in better hands allstate at visionworks, and we want you to see yourself in your new glasses and think, ooh but if you get home and your ooh is more of a hmm. You have 100 days to change your mind. 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Vote no on the deceptive uber, lyft, doordash prop 22. One ride california doesnt want to take. Still 28 days until election day and more than 4 million americans have already voted. Election experts say the staggering numbers are breaking numbers, which is expected. Its certainly likely that it will lead to the highest voter turnout in years, perhaps ever. In ohio where early voting started today, huge lines in hamilton county, which includes cincinnati and the surrounding area. The local board of elections chair said she expects nearly 500,000 voters to turn out this year. In houston, texas, where early voting doesnt start until next week, hundreds of people lined up to drop off their ballots in person after texas governor, greg abbott, mandated there be only one dropoff location per county regardless of size. Thats one dropoff location for all of harris county, which includes houston. This as the president impeached and infected polls about as badly as an incumbent president has polled in recent memory. Our own nbc news wall street journal poll conducted after the first president ial debate but before the president s covid diagnosis became public showed joe biden leading the president by 14 points nationally, 53 to 39 . A cnn poll taken while news of the president s illness broke found joe biden up by 16 points over trump, 57 to 41 . And a brandnew poll released today from the Boston Herald shows biden up 14 points, 51 to 37 , with his support growing considerably in the days after the president s covid diagnosis was announced. Also, statewide, local polling is looking terrible for donald trump. Polling averages from seven key battleground states, pennsylvania, North Carolina, florida, michigan, wisconsin, arizona and nevada all have trump trailing biden. And in pennsylvania, the monmouth poll, which showed a tight race last month, now has joe biden up 11 points among high likely turnout voters in the state. 54 to trumps 43 . The last time trump was polling this badly in an Election Year was basically exactly this time four years ago, right after the infamously disgusting access Hollywood Tape came out. He dropped to around 38 the following weeks, and the trump people point out that everyone thought he was definitely done back then and well, then, he wasnt, was he . So is it any different this time around . Ill ask pollster Cornell Belcher about that next. Dont go anywhere. An herbal stress reliever ashwagandha, that helps you turn the stressed life. Into your best life. Stress less and live more. With stressballs. Tech every customer has their own safelite story. This couple was on a camping trip. When their windshield got a chip. They drove to safelite for a sameday repair. And with their insurance, it was no cost to them. 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I think its just incredibly selfish of, you know, older people, on neurotic people who are timid and afraid and wont come out of this basements to consign children and young people to miss out on the most important parts of their lives on schooling and on the prime of youth. The trump and trump tv message to seniors basically is dont be so selfish, get out there, mingle with the virus. If you get sick and die, well, its for the greater good. Remember when back in march texas Lieutenant Governor Diane Patrick went on fox news to argue that Older Americans will willingly sacrifice themselves to keep the economy afloat. A couple weeks ago at a rally in ohio, trump insisted the virus only affects elderly people while calling for a broader reopening. Saying essentially, look, a virus that kills mostly old people is not really worth containing. Lo and behold, turns out this argument is not playing super well with seniors. An nbc wall street journal poll out last week found biden leading trump with seniors by nearly 30 points. A new cnn poll out today has biden up 21 points with seniors. Four years ago this age group was a cornerstone of trumps coalition. He won them pretty handily. Now he is being annihilated in that demographic. Here to talk about where trump stands with seniors right now and the broader polling picture, someone who follows this stuff very closely, my friend Cornell Belcher, democratic pollster. Lets start on the senior numbers, cornell, because in the crazy making world weve lived in since he came down the escalator in 2015, the one thing that feels like it makes sense is donald trump basically telling seniors like, i dont care, get out there and seniors being like, no thank you. And its just, like like 2 plus 2 seems to equal 4. What is your read on it . Well, first, chris, im going to im going to apologize to you because i know you and i had you say, well, this day hes going to make his his support weaken and begin to collapse a little bit and i say, oh, chris, youre crazy, but if you look inside these numbers, chris, this is kind of what a collapse looks like. Look, on the way to winning his backtoback majorities in 2012, barack obama lost seniors by 12 points. Yeah. Hes now biden is now winning them by 20plus points. And i think it really is a watershed moment. I mean, structurally, this looks like nothing ive seen before. Structurally, look, youve got to go back five or six decades to find a democrat winning a majority of white voters. And if this polling trend line continues, you know, bidens at 51 with white voters. Chris, that hasnt happened in, you know, in in five or six decades. Right. I mean, barack obama garnered, what, 38 , 39 of the white vote in 2012 on his way to 51 support. So structurally yeah. We are at a watershed moment. Things are different now than i think ive ever seen them, you know, for democrats in polling nationally. Thats its a really important point because we have been having this ongoing conversation. One of the reasons i want to come back to you on this, you said something that stuck with me i think the last time we talked the importance of the number 50, right . If someones polling above 50 , 51 , 52, its better to be up 5 points polling at 52 that up 8 points pulling at 36 to 58 . Postaccess hollywood, the gap was big, but clinton was still under 50 , even when she was beating him by a lot. Biden, 57 , 51 52 in the Morning Consult poll. 59 in an nbc news wall street journal like, it seems like he is reliably hitting that number. What do you think . You know, again, ive reason rather cautionary in my conversation about the trend line here, but with these new rounds of numbers, look, you know, 57 , 56 support, it is looking like its looking like something different. It is looking like, in fact, a collapse, of which i didnt think was possible, where he may not get to the 46 that we saw him get to in 2016 and was able to squeak in in some of these states. But what this means broader, chris, if if biden is now, you know, winning white voters and hes running up the score 33, you know, point margin among College White voters, what does this mean . It means that texas right. Something that, again, becomes in play. It means states like North Carolina that have been sort of, you know, purplish but more reddish, all of a sudden those are more in play. It means states like arizona that have been red is in play. It means the battlefield opens up for for for for biden to win. Has not opened up for a democrat in a long lodge time. You know, its interesting too because i saw an ad today, a national ad the Biden Campaign was running on fox news, actually. And it we got polling out today from the cnn poll that shows biden squeaking ahead on the economy issue. And this ad was interesting to me because it was it was like a very bread and butter democrat ad. They really leaned into the nuts and bolts of im a moderate democrat, im a white guy, you know me, and the ad was jobs. Were going to create 18 million new jobs. Were going to double the minimum wage. Were going to higher wages for people and expand health care. That was it. That was the ad. Like the most bread and butter democratic messages and i, you know, those are pretty good those are, you know, 6040 issues. The same ad that democrats have been running forever. Bread and butter ads, but it hasnt really meant anything. And, again, what is structurally different here, weve talked about this before, chris, even when obama was against romney, you know, romney on the question of who could handle the economy better, romney had advantage over obama. Obama had an advantage over who would make the economy work for more people like you, but the fact now that biden has an advantage on even the economy and he has a doubledigit advantage on dealing with crime and safety, sort of their bread and butter issue, and he has a huge advantage on health care, he has a huge advantage on dealing with racial issues. I dont know this looks this looks and feels like a potential collapse to me. And i think structurally this is different than it was in 2016 when you look at all these numbers. And also, this is also key. Bidens favorables are above water in these polls the way hillarys favorables were not. Right. And right now trumps favorables are, you know, low minus 20 depending on the poll. So this is very different. I guess the final point here, you know, i think you everyone is so has had their head spun around by this white house so much and doesnt know what to trust that when the news broke at 1 00 a. M. The president had been diagnosed with covid there was lots of, like, conspiracy theorizing, oh, theyre making it up for a sympathy play and all sorts of crazy stuff pinging around , particularly in the first few hours as people are digesting the news, but it seems pretty clear to me that talking about the failures of the Coronavirus Response is not, like, the winning message for the president , even if its mixed with, like, personal sympathy for a 74yearold man who has a severe illness, which i think everyone feels. It chris, they are really bad at campaigning. I mean, this is i mean, this is just terrible. I mean, the imagery of all that last night and then trying to stand up on the balcony and look like a strong leader after hes hes contracted covid and theres no covid plan. Yeah. What youre seeing in data right now is Covid Recovery plan is top of the list for what voters want in congress. And dont be surprised when you see Congressional Democrats using the failure of republicans to to come up with a Covid Response plan in connection to this president and using it in advertising. All right. Cornell belcher, thanks for your time. On that note, were 24 hours until the next debate. The first time to roll out thats the stage right there. And you can see the protective plexiglass that mike pence, supposedly the head of the Coronavirus Task force, is complaining about. The unprecedented stakes of that harris pence debate tomorrow night. Next. Anywhere convenience. Everyday security. Bankers here to help. For wherever you want to go. Chase. Make more of whats yours. Before we talk about taxsaudreys expecting. New . Twins wed be closer to the twins. Change in plans. At fidelity, a change in plans is always part of the plan. To save you up to 60 . These are all great. And when you get a big deal. You feel like a big deal. Priceline. Every trip is a big deal. Its tsleep numberp numbe360 smart bed. On the can it help keep me asleep . Absolutely, it intelligently senses your movements and automatically adjusts to keep you both comfortable. Save 25 on the sleep number 360® c4 smart bed with any Smart Adjustable base. Plus 0 interestfor 36 months. Ends tuesday. Traffic and air pollution will be even worse after the pandemic. Thats why we support measure rr to keep caltrain running. Which is at risk of shutdown because of the crisis. To keep millions of cars off our roads, to reduce air pollution and fight climate change. And measure rr helps essential workers like me get to work and keep our communities healthy. Relieve traffic. Reduce pollution. Rescue caltrain. [all] yes on measure rr. So, the last debate was a disaster both in its content and also as a Public Health event. 11 people involved if had debate preparations got sick. The trump family refused to wear masks inside the debate hall, though they were required by the cleveland clinic. And we still dont know whether trump himself was sick and contagious at this point youre seeing on the screen. So, the Debate Commission is trying to not have a repeat this time around. Organizers will be keeping Kamala Harris and mike pence 12 feet apart tomorrow night in salt lake city. There will be plexiglass around Kamala Harris though not around mike pence, per his request. Joining me, good to have you both on the program. Congresswoman, i know youve been close to Kamala Harris for years, a mentor of hers. Tomorrow night is a huge moment for her, the first black woman to appear in this role in the countrys history. What do you expect her goal is tomorrow night . I think senator harris is going to talk directly to the american people. Shes going to talk about how the bidenharris team will, first of all, take on this pandemic day one. Secondly, how shes going to move forward with our president , joe biden, to bring our economy back in a much better shape than what it was better. And thirdly, i think shes going to really move forward tomorrow night in the debate to help unify the country and not allow Vice President pence to try to divide democrats and to make a mockery out of the debate. Shes a strong leader. She has integrity, and shes very smart. You know, mike pence is in an interesting position, mckay. Hes a real hes a normy republican. Hes a genuine believing White Christian evangelical, cut from the cloth, what weaves together this coalition. And some ways hes got to go out and defend the indefensible. But tomorrow more than ever. Hes the head of the Coronavirus Task force and they have an outbreak in their workplace. This is the key point. Mike pences job has always been to kind of be the more palpable face of trumpism. Hes the kinder, gentler Christian Republican who has the kind of performative modesty thing going for him. I remember talking to a trump adviser a couple of years ago who said when he goes out there he seeks peaks on trumps behal people who may not be into the whole shtick. He is the face in a lot of ways of the administrations biggest failure, the Coronavirus Response. He was the head of the Coronavirus Task force by all accounts according to all polls we see, this is a terrible issue for trump. And i think hes going to be held accountable tomorrow at the debate. And im not sure you know, in 2016, he did a pretty effective job of kind of deflecting attacks and trying to wriggle his way out of being asked about trumps various inflammatory statements. I think its going to be a little harder this time because this is his record as much as it is trump. Thats a great point. I wonder, congressman lee, the last debate was unwatchable because the president acted like an antisocial maniac and interrupted people all the time. It would be nice to have a little bit of substantive exchange on things like abortion, Supreme Court, health care. One thing i would love to see and wonder what you think of this, congresswoman, is just senator harris laying out the Health Care Plan in simple terms so people know what theyre voting for or against. I can tell you one thing about senator harris, shes very clear about the bidenharris plan, and shes very clear on what theyre going to do on day one. We have the covid crisis who has killed 210,000 people, 7 million have contracted the virus. So, the bidenharris plan is very clear. Its very succinct. Shes going to give a road map on what exactly theyre going to do to crush this pandemic, as Speaker Pelosi says, but also to move forward to create goodpaying jobs and to bring the country together because now we have got to be unified as we face this pandemic together. To me, her Harris Mission here is to do what trumps interrupting wouldnt let happen last time, which is to lay out the time. She doesnt is are to score any points on mike pence or dunk on mike pence. Theres an outbreak in the white house. The president is hospitalized with the virus they cant adequately fight. She has to say what theyre going to do. And for pence, mckay, im curious what about he does on choice, roe. The polling is 20 points on the other side of them. I wonder if mike pence is yes, we are finally putting someone on that Supreme Court whos going to overturn roe, or does he get squirrely as well. Thats an interesting question. His job is Holding Together the conservative element of trumps base. The Supreme Court is the whole game. Its because of abortion. Its because of roe. I think hes going to be tempted to make that case and lean really hard into that issue. As you pointed out, its not clear to me that the talking point coming out of the white house and from the Trump Campaign are as clearly antiabortion or in favor of getting rid of roe as maybe some of the conservative christian base would like to see. To me, him saying, theres nothing to see here, or something to that effect in the first debate, and jody ernst saying i dont know if theyll overturn roe. Theyre looking at the same polling we are. Thank you both. Appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. That is all in ons tuesday night. The Rachel Ma Doe show starts right now. Good evening rachel. Thanks for joining me. Congresswoman ocasiocortez will be joining me tonight. She lives rentfree fulltime inside the mind of the conservative media and the trump white house, both of which are obsessed with her. But the district that she represents in congress has been one of the hardesthit congressional districts in the entire country when it comes to covid19. So, congresswoman ocasiocortez, better known by her initials aoc, she will be joining us live tonight, specifically to respond to the news

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