back with john prendergast and george clooney. john, you frequently use the word "robust" to explain the diplomacy needed. would you break that down for me? what consequence at this constitutes robust? >> it's a good question. the one thing we're very good at is diplomacy. we have done that for years and have been very successful at it. we were successful in 2005 in this exact same region. we know the map. it requires -- they're going to have to find -- they're going to decide on a border, they're going to decide on profit sharing, and it's going to require going to the governor of khartoum and saying if you go by all of these rules, and if you -- including darfur, and if you seek peace, then there can be carrots. there can be rewards for that, including what they would like, which is normalizing some relations with the u.s. on the other hand, we have to use the international community as much as possible to say, on