had been, you know, is a republican, bush's key guy. obama left in charge the occ head who was a disaster, that the general was just talking about, mr. doing ogan and such. left for an entire term where he proceeded not to regulate. so it's an appalling policy but it's bizarre politics on the part of the obama administration as well. >> it seems from everything i've heard and read and that eliot has explained to me over the course of this show that it is a systemic problem and to the extent it is systemic how do you -- do you see that certain -- that individuals should be punished or do you see just reform is the answer? >> again, i think you hit exactly the right points. our emphasis, than comes from economics, from white collar criminality, which is what i am as well, and a former financial regulator, is you've got to look at incentive structures. you've got to fix the incentive structures because they're what shapes the individuals and the