>> that's us. >> and that's no jive. >> the jacksons were the last act from the classic motown hitsville system. >> motown was a very unique place. a lot of record companies were run by businessmen. we had a music man at the helm. berry gordon wrote music for the world. >> ironically, here was trying his best to make black music that would cross over to the white world. he ended up creating the best black music ever. >> he created a machine. where you take the artist, polish them up. and make them a great package and they can play the "ed sullivan show" and kill. >> marvin gaye wanted to be frank sinatra. he was clean, svelte. all that changed in the '70s. >> marvin wanted to compete at a high level. why can't i make a record like the beatles? i'm selling records like they sell.