hillary, he then confessed on national television to lester holt that when i fired him, i was thinking about this russia business. now we know that he also potentially obstructed justice at the front end of it. >> if there was ever a president who was going to play constitutional chicken, it is president trump. he is saying i am above the law and he is daring other people to say no. what if mueller doesn't have a criminal indictment? that would be a really high standard. i don't know if it's going to happen, but i can say confidently it's unlike. is he a president that would dare the house to impeach him and the senate to convict him? absolutely. >> well, in fairness to dowd, there is really a very much an open constitutional question -- >> right. it's been never settled. >> about whether a president can be indicted for obstruction of justice or anything, murder, stealing cars. i mean, the idea of whether a sitting president can be indicted. the problem with what dowd said it is suggests he can't even be impeached for obstruction of justice and that's what we know