both of them really, both sides are clearly seeing for whatever reason a public relations necessity to keep ratcheting it up and in public. i think it seems to be more of a pr strategy here. >> it is. >> than a legal strategy. it's hard to imagine when it comes to michael cohen's legal defense that it is a good thing to put this tape out there. >> yeah. >> this is about the pr war. >> i think it's a pr strategy. look, michael cohen feels that the president has kind of left him in the dust. and that he's rejected him and that has left him out there, hanging out there. that cohen has not gotten a lot of love from the president or from the family after all he's done for them. and i think he feels that he wants his name back. and this is one way to do it, as dana points out. it's a pr strategy. the question is whether it's a legal strategy and we don't know