leadership, and we should listen to them and not listen to this president and just let him be because what'd you say, don't be a sucker? >> don't be a sucker. >> don't be a sucker. okay, don't be a sucker. has he mentioned the caravan scareavan? >> no. >> vanished. >> i call it scareavan. has the mothership really talked about it much? >> nope. >> okay. the voter fraud commission, remember thousands of people voted illegally. >> crow's down, and he just lost his race for governor. >> okay. so then don't be a sucker. don't be a sucker. >> i hear you. i'm not saying that it's about waiting for his virtue to blossom and come into full flower. >> don't waste your breath. >> that's not what i'm saying. >> yes, he should. >> i think it's a practical -- >> i don't see him as somebody burdened by conviction, somebody who's confused or waiting to develop. he's like 70 something years old. i think he does it only because