his race for governor. >> okay. so then don't be a sucker. don't be a sucker. >> i hear you. i'm not saying that it's about waiting for his virtue to blossom and come into full flower. >> don't waste your breath. >> that's not what i'm saying. >> yes, he should. >> i think it's a practical -- >> i don't see him as somebody burdened by conviction, somebody who's confused or waiting to develop. he's like 70 something years old. i think he does it only because he thinks it works, and i don't know why he thinks it works. i really don't. he had this initial program that jared was supposed to be in charge of called djt 100. his goal when he became president was to find a way to 100% popularity. >> it does work for him in the moment. >> he just got clobbered in this popular vote. >> it works for him in the moment, chris. >> i know but i'm telling you i grew up in these places. i watched all the data, and they talked to these guys. >> i respect that. >> anybody who looks at the data is going to say to him we've got stuff we've got to work on for 2020. >> i respect your political prowess, and your family's political prowess. >> just experience, i have no