whether the extortion is -- it is actually extortion. because any cooperation agreement requires you not to commit any further crimes. so if this is a crime, the whole thing goes out the window. but, the question of whether it's a crime or not is the one we're debating. >> you knew david pecker. you worked for him for years. is he worried today? >> i don't think he's worried. think he's really confident. look how he's been operating, right. someone who is worried doesn't go out and be as boold as held been especially being on good behavior because of the deal he cut. i think similar to donald trump he thinks nothing sticks to him and can he keep doing business as usual. >> but do you think something is different about this time? jeff bezos has beaten them at their own game in terms of going public with embarrassing details before they could. certainly about the pictures. he has very deep pockets. he's the richest man, you know, on earth. so is this time different for the "national enquirer"? >> i think it is. they didn't anticipate his reaction that he would fight them because most people just