balance. in weighing and balancing those equities, i think will be a strong message here sent as it relates to chauvin's conduct. that's the punishment. and as it relates to deterrence moving forward, others who might look to engage in something similar. >> joey, i have to ask you about this. the defense is asking for probation? could that actually happen? >> i don't believe it will happen at all and i think it's particularly offensive, quite frankly. as the defense attorney, just to be clear, and i'm proud to be, you can't argue against facts and law and you can't argue against reality. and i think it really undermines your position when you do. as i noted before, you have sentencing guidelines. if you want to ask the judge to depart from those guidelines, you have to have specific reasons which might justify that request and when you have the aggravating factors found here, i don't think there's any compelling, significant or other reason why a judge would depart from that. it undercuts your argument when you say something that is just