people and doing one-on-one voter contact. martha: i iowa is big question. i don't think anyone knows who will win eye awe. they're looking at each other in their meetings saying get you on the ground in iowa and talking to people and get rid of this herman cain person. >> the problem if he says he will not do the debates he will be hit merslessly for chickening out. it will look bad. martha: yeah. >> i will say perry has a point in a sense there awful lot of debates coming up, perhaps a dozen, 18, remember some of the debates were planned when we thought the iowa caucuses would be on february 6th. now they will be on january 3rd. a lot less time. more debates and less time to have them. martha: "saturday night live", welcome to the 7th or possibly 8th republican national debate. that was pretty funny. talk about mitt romney. he had back and forth on issue in ohio. this is fascinating issue for him and how tough he will be on the unions.