in places where there are fewer people. this is anti-democratic. it is not to me politics as usual. the republican governors get it. you just read off a list of governors that maybe not because they're up in 2014. they realize they might get punished. >> but governor mcdonald is not up in 2014. i think he made a principle argument. >> he is up in 2016. >> in a presidential year. >> he is a one-term governor. >> i'm saying -- >> yeah, but the two years between 2014 and 2016 is large in politics, and a lot more will happen. >> a lot of the governors should take heed of. that which you control today you may not come the next election. if the voters deem your actions to be hostile to their interests. >> we're also talking about a sort of -- i mean, this is -- these are sort of identity shifts, and i'll read an excerpt from "the atlantic" which talks about the urban-rural divide, and it says the new political divide is a stark division between cities and what remains of the country side.