and it's a major area in that sense. >> just from a strategic standpoint obviously we don't know what's in the mind of vladimir putin or his generals at this point. but just from your military knowledge, does it make more sense to surround a city like kharkiv and kind of come back to it later if you're trying to establish control over the entire country? i mean, do you want to try to get troops on the ground in as many places as possible to lock it down and then move in on heavily populated cities, or do you do that all at once? >> it really depends on what your ultimate goal is. if your ultmal goal is we think it might be they take over kyiv, then to basically decapitate the ukrainian government, then it would make sense to bypass -- surround and bypass cities like kharkiv. go over and take the big objective first and then go back and take care of the rest, kind of a mopping up operation would