the united states was trying to get out. but that's not a permanent solution. and i just don't -- i don't see it. >> michele, what do you say to that fatalism? >> well, it's hard to be optimistic about iraq, but i am not quite as fatalistic. the question is whether this recent set of protests and this moment, with the support of the religious leader creates an opportunity for him to push those reforms through and give the sunnis the prospect of a different future in iraq. that is the only way that they will stand up and fight, that plus the assurances from the united states that we'll be behind them. but absent that, i agree. you're not going to see much progress. >> in any event, i think everyone agrees this is the crucial issue, to see whether these reforms work and whether the sunnis can be brought back into the fold. thank you both very much. next on "gps," you have heard of the red planet, you all know about the red sea, but i bet you are not familiar with a nation called the red dot. when we come back, we'll tell