mitchell: he really believed that daytime television needed to talk about the ideas we were thinking about, the issues we were concerned about. [ chuckles ] i don't want to characterize his question, but why don't you get this fixed instead of doing this screwy stuff? there's not a single recorded case in history of any transsexual, that ever, through psychological treatment, changed. it has never happened yet. we were putting very important people on the program. all kinds of people. gay people. people going to jail. people running for office, you know? sometimes the same people. it was a magic carpet ride. you really do paint a very, very grim, picture of the sitting president of the united states. let me just say this -- i think he's probably the laziest president that i've ever seen. the audience for phil donahue built and built and built and built and led the way to "oprah." ♪