plemting the administration's policy on ukraine. in the spring of 2019, i became aware of outside influencers promoting a false narrative of ukraine inconsistent with the consensus views of the interagency. this narrative was harmful to u.s. government policy. while my interagency colleagues and i were becoming increasingly optimistic on ukraine's prospects, this alternative narrative undermined u.s. government efforts to expand cooperation with ukraine. so many officials were concerned about this alternative narrative, it shows how deep the concerns went, right? >> oh, exactly, don. and the fact that this has been borne out by, in my view, very credible people, most notably for me ambassador taylor, now colonel vindman, and i think as well as what was reflected in the whistle-blower complaint. and i think they were reflecting probably -- almost certainly the views of many others who had