Breakthrough on immigration, a 5 billion appropriation wisely spent would go a long way to securing our border. Its just not about physical barriers. Its about other things. If we could find a way to make sure that the Daca Recipients have a work permit, it certainly makes their lives better. The tps population, i think all of us are trying to find a way to help them. So theres a deal to be had. The wall has become a metaphor for border security. And what were talking about is a physical barrier where it makes sense. In the past, every democrat has voted for these physical barriers. It cant be just about because trump wants it, we no longer agree with it. Theres nothing immoral about a physical barrier along the border in places that make sense. So therell never be a deal, at the end of this year, the beginning of next, that doesnt have money for the physical barriers that we all have in the past agreed we need. The president is not asking for too much. And were going to put on the table some ideas that have been embraced in the past. The question is can we stop hating each other enough up here to find a way forward that would be a win win. Again, thats senator Lindsey Graham after spending two hours with the president at the white house. There was a lot of what he had to say. Lets begin to sort of digest this. Sarah westwood joins us from the white house. Graham saying the president is open minded to a compromise. You may not know that based on what weve heard from the white house so far though, right . Reporter thats right. Senator Lindsey Graham pitching his idea for a potential deal as something of a breakthrough if it could gain traction. He said President Trump didnt commit to the trade of some relief for the daca population in exchange for some wall funding. Keep in mind, there very several attempts to put together support for these kinds of deals in the past. Both times its fallen apart, hasnt gotten enough support to get to President Trumps desk. Senator graham also blames democrats for furthering the stalemate by constantly saying what theyre not going to fund and not saying enough about what they would support. Take a listen. All i can say is that the democrats have said theyre not going to give him a dime for a border wall. The house will change next week. Theyre going to send over a bill from the house that wont have any money for a physical barrier, a wall, fence, artistically designed slats, and thats not going to fly. So the approach the democrats have taken have made it pretty hard to have a discussion. Theyre telling us what they wont do. Acting chief of staff budget director Nick Mulvaney has suggested in the past that President Trump might be willing to come down off that 5 billion demand for wall funding, but he hasnt said by how much. Now, keep in mind theres also a debate raging right now about what exactly constitutes a wall. Outgoing chief of staff john kelly said this administration actually abandoned the idea of a physical border wall early in trumps presidency. He told the Los Angeles Times in an interview, to be honest, its not a wall. The president still says wall. Oftentimes, frankly, hell say barrier or fencing. Now hes tended towards steel slats, but we left a solid concrete wall early on in the administration. Obviously this deal that senator graham described out of his lunch with the president today still in the very early preliminary stages. We havent heard a lot about what democrats would be willing to consider. Mulvaney said Democratic Congressional leaders havent been invited back to the white house for further talks. All right. Sarah, i also find it notable that the president s only reaction, at least according to the senator, was one word. That word was interesting. Thats after two hours of lunch. Sarah westwood, thanks very much. All right. Lets talk about this. To do that, we have Wesley Lowery from the Washington Post and White House Reporter for the new york times, micha michael shear. Let me start with michael and just ask the obvious. Do you hear something out of whatever weve learned now from the senator and apparently this lunch that makes you say, hey, were on the cusp of maybe ending this partial Government Shutdown . You know, im super skeptical, martin. Look, this is senator graham expressing his own hopes. Hes been an advocate for some kind of deal like this for an awful long time, before trump was even on the scene. Then trying to figure out some deal with trump. The problem on both sides, you have democrats who are not going to be willing for the kind of limited relief for the daca population, the socalled dreamers who have been living in this country illegally since they were very small children, the kind of sort of limited relief that senator graham is talking about. The left and democrats are not going to be satisfied with that. And on trumps right, there are people like Stephen Miller and others in that community who are going to demand other sorts of restrictionist policies that cut back on different kinds of legal immigration. So when you get both of the extremes into the mix, these kinds of deals tend to fall apart. Unfortunately, i dont see any reason to think, despite senator grahams optimism this morning, i dont see any reason to think that would change. What about this thing, wesley, that the wall is not a wall, its a metaphor . Its not really this construct. Its talking about all sorts of things, whether its security, whether its a fence, or whether its perhaps legislation of some way . I think two things are true. The first is that, you know, there is something to be said for that. The president campaigned and was elected on a platform that was about securing the border broadly but also a platform that was about this feeling of who is american, who belongs here, and who does not and who potentially threatens the economy. There was some Poetic License there. That said, this was one of the chief concrete promises of candidate trump. He was going to construct a physical wall. I can imagine in fact, im almost surprised we havent seen trumps tweeting already about what john kelly said about it not really being a wall. While i think folks around the president may say that and while thats probably true in terms of the administrations policies, many of his supporters are very whetted to this idea of building this physical barrier. So much so, its one of the reasons the president has backed himself into a corner on this Government Shutdown. He said this is about constructing a wall, constructing physical barriers. Can he walk away now without getting some of that . Its unclear. Well, possibly immigration, immigration reform, and security. Very complex subjects. So you come up with one simple phrase, a wall. And bam, you use that as your kind of shorthand speak. Im wondering, wesley, the democrats may say, all right, look, i got to give you 5 billion for your border security. In exchange, im only getting something that might help these daca youths. It may not satisfy democrats. What about the public at large who are already getting very upset with seeing a partial Government Shutdown drag on . Certainly. And i think we cant lose sight of the fact that there are hundreds of thousands, almost a million federal employees whose paychecks are in peril. That doesnt even begin to count the contract employees who are not receiving pay because of this. As this stretches on, there will be increasing political pressure. This is a case where the president has said very proudly, hes boasted in the oval office about how this shutdown is on me, im going to take credit for it. Unless the democrats were to start feeling some type of political pressure, and im not sure they would, this seems like something the president will have to cave on. Michael, do you think its the president who is in the hot seat here, that democrats can sort of sit back and whaatch wh happens . I think its always dangerous for a Political Party to take for granted that the other side is going to be blamed. Politics is a kind of continually shifting business. But i do think i agree with wes. If you look at the way this particular shutdown has played out, the president seems to be more likely to be blamed by a broader sort of subset of the population than the democrats are for right now. So i think one of the ways that he may find is his only way out of this mess is to sort of declare, sort of find a way to declare victory and go move on. One of those ways might be to simply say weve already built a lot of the wall, were building more of the wall with money we already had appropriated. Im going to order the military to the border and say thatll be enough and move on to the next suj subject. That may be the way we get out of this. Real quick, wes leley. Isnt the real danger that the president says, you know what, no . That is one of the major dangers. Weve seen Democratic Leaders sa say, look, were not going to discuss any possible solutions unless we have the president endorsing it beforehand. This would be true of any executive, but particularly this one, that unless the president himself is backing this, nothing is guaranteed. Theres no deal thats guaranteed. This particular president very likely could see something hammered out, hashed out, and not like the way its playing out here on cnn or elsewhere and change his mind. Until the president himself has signed on to a deal, who knows whats going to happen. Michael, last ten seconds. How long does this go on, this partial shutdown . It lasts at least through the end of this week when the democrats will take over in the house. Then i think folks i talk to suggest it could last another week or more as they try to position themselves for who has whos going to get the blame and who can avoid it. All right. Michael and wes, thank you very much. Thanks for having us. Well, as lawmakers battle over border wall funding, hundreds of thousands of federal workers are either on furlough or working without knowing when theyll get their next paycheck. Joining me now via skype is justin, a correctional officer at u. S. Penitentiary hazelton in west virginia. He also serves as the executive Vice President of the union that represents the officers that work at that facility. Justin, thank you very much. Let me ask you this. Most americans probably dont feel significantly impacted by this, if theyre not working for the government. But you are. So what has this done both to your own life and to the morale of those officers you serve with . Well, i mean, just take for instance the shutdown started on saturday. I worked nine hours of overtime. That nine hours of pay is currently on leave without pay. That affects me, you know, if i want to travel during the holidays, buy gifts for my family, or pay off bills, as in your mortgage. So within that, that could drive morale down, especially if youre an officer. You go in to a United States penitentiary every day to protect the community, protect the inmates, to protect staff, and thats going to be on the back of your mind. That can affect you, you know, away from the prison mentally. Youre not youre told youre not going to be paid. That could drive your morale down. Of course. Im wondering, as a correctional officer, that job is a very tough task. Its also sometimes very dangerous. Does all of this weigh into the stress for your family, about your safety but their Financial Security . Oh, absolutely. I agree with that, yes, sir. You know, a lot of times when you leave the facility, sometimes youre supposed to leave that behind. Sometimes it can filter into your home life, especially if youre not going to get paid. Thats one thing you got to try to keep reserve on and keep your head up high and keep pushing and go inside of that prison done a what you can for the safety and security of the civilians of america and also the community. Does it ever make you second guess doing this job at all . In other words, going and finding some other line of work . When youre relying on the government, its becoming too unreliable. No, you know, the last shutdown we had was for 16 days. It kind of makes me put my chin up a little bit higher and say, you know, i want to keep fighting, i want to do what i can for the american public, to do the right thing. Hopefully both sides, whether youre democrat, republican, or the president , they can get this done and hash it out for us, for the voters, for the citizens. Im going to keep pushing on and do what i can for the public. We do appreciate it. Let me ask you this, and i always ask the same question, which is if you could talk to the president , if you could talk to congress, and in a way you sort of are, what would you say . What would you encourage them to do . You know, i support what everybody does on beth sides, but right now lets just get this Government Back open as quickly as possible for all of us, whether youre republican or democrat. Lets get this going and lets make sure especially during the holidays, you know, for all our federal employees, for our families, please. Justin tarovisky, thanks. We appreciate the work you do, all those men and women. Thank you, sir. Still ahead, more on the breaking news. Senator graham changing his tune, now saying President Trump made him feel better about pulling u. S. Troops from the battlefield in syria. What about the fight against isis . Well talk about that after this break. Nick, nick, we need a decision. These days we all feel a little anxious sometimes. But if you could see inside my mind; youll find i go to my happy place. See if we let tensions run the show up here, then our bodies wont perform at their best out here. Wait, arent we going to the sound check . Priorities. So im partnering with cigna, to remind you that how youre doing emotionally affects you physically. Go for your annual checkup and be open with your doctor about anything youre feeling. Physically, and emotionally. Body and mind cigna. Together all the way. Were following breaking news on syria. Moments ago after a long meeting with President Trump, senator Lindsey Graham says were, quote, in a pause situation. Graham has said he worried if the u. S. Pulls out of syria now, it could make way for an isis comeback and put u. S. Allies, such as the kurds, at risk. But after a twohour meeting with the president at the white house, graham now seems encouraged by the president s decision and says trump remains committed to defeating isis. Take a listen. I think the president has come up with a plan with his generals generals that makes sense to me. The goal is to make sure isis doesnt come back. We left iraq too soon. We had them on the ropes in iraq, left too soon. I think the president s very committed to making sure when we leave syria that isis is completely defeated and were inside the tenyard line. And the iran kurd situation has to be dealt with. I think were in a pause situation. Were reevaluating whats the best way to achieve the president s objective of having people pay more and do more. With me now to discuss is a retired air force colonel. Thank you for being here. You bet, martin. Let. Let me start with you, colonel. I listened to senator graham. I initially thought he went in there to change the president s mind. Im not sure whose mind got changed here. Let me ask where are professional opinion. Did you like what you heard . Im very concerned about it, martin. I really didnt like what i heard because i heard somebody who seemed to have been convinced by the president that it was the right thing to do to pull our troops out at this particular point in time. But then on the other hand, theres this talk about staying the course and defeating isis. That part i definitely applaud. If theres a plan to make that happen, thats wonderful. The only problem that you have with it is if you dont have troops on the ground or at least a provision for people to get into syria in some way or form, then that would become almost an undoable type of plan. It really wouldnt work in an operational sense. And aaron, speaking of the undoable, the president s announcement to pull the troops out has already prompted defense secretary mattis to resign. Its forced the kurds now to apparently go to the assad regime to ask for some kind of protection. Of course, the russians seem to be applauding all of this. Im wondering, has the damage already been done . Have the dominos in the region already started to fall and you cant butt this genput this gen . The process was abysmal. Without consultation, without deliberation, no briefing of congress, no briefing of allies, delighted adversaries, allies feeling betrayed, and no effort to negotiate conditional withdrawal with the russians and the turks in order to do what we could to constrain turkey and get the russians involved in trying to broker a deal between the Syrian Government and the kurds. Look, the kurds have maintained their connections to the Syrian Regime and have been hedging their bets, i suspect, for months now. I mean, i think the process of Decision Making that led to withdrawal was horrible. But im not entirely persuaded that the compelling arguments for keeping 2200 American Forces in syria with an openended mission and inflated goals that we cannot possibly achieve really is the right course of action. You want to defeat isis, and i think the notion of defeating isis isis is not japan or germany. Youre not going to break their will to fight. Theyre going to be in syria because the syrian Humpty Dumpty is broken, dysfunctional. The assad regime adds to that. So do the russians. Its degrading containing isis. I think thats the strategy. Thats going to be more difficult without American Forces, no doubt. Colonel, what about you know, we do have forces in western iraq, which is very close to the border with syria. Isnt it possible you could pursue the same objectives without u. S. Forces on the ground in syria but just across the way in western iraq . From a strictly military standpoint, it is possible to do at least part of