Hello again and welcome. Its time to break down the big stories with some smart people today, were asking with Donald Trumps first criminal trial, just two days away low jurors here, more slays than substance. Then the debate debate should News Organizations porch for president ial debates, given trumps pension for lives and fake france, the new social media app giving you all the social media satisfaction without any of the actual social media, the pamelas here and ready to go so sit back, relax and lets talk about up first. Donald trump is about to make history becoming the first former president to sit as a defendant in a criminal trial . Jury selection begins monday in a case involving Hush Money Payments to porn star Stormy Daniels. A trial that could carry Major Political and legal consequences for trump including possible jail time. Election interference by biden, Donald Trumps set to face 34 Felony Counts and a manhattan courtroom. We cannot and will not normalize serious criminal conduct. District attorney alvin bragg, accusing trump are paying porn star Stormy Daniels during the 20th, 16 election ben, to keep quiet about an alleged sexual encounter, the two had a decade before we have drug dealers all over the place that they go after trump some legal analysts have questioned the legitimacy of the charges of all the cases. This is the weakest one, while perhaps week and legal substance, the trial is sure to be rich salacious, tabloid detail about trumps personal life. Hi everyone, including daniels claim of an encounter. She says happened months after Melania Trump gave birth to a son, barron. I came out of the bathroom to find myself cornered if convicted from sentence could range from probation to prison and a guilty verdict could spell bad news. For trump in november with several polls showing biden pulling ahead. If trumps convicted of a felony kopan, you run for election and be sitting courthouse in manhattan all day long joining me here in New York Times journalist and podcast house, lulu garcianavarro editor in chief of the dispatch and columnist at the la times jonah goldberg, niamalika henderson politics and policy columnist at bloomberg, and aly yada johnson, editor in chief for the washington and free begun. Welcome everyone, especially nia, who was a first timer. Its great to be here. The new york case is based on the argument the trump falsified Business Records to cover up a crime. He claimed he was paying fixer michael cohen, normal legal expenses. What it was allegedly a violation of election laws. Hush money to Stormy Daniels during the campaign. Jonah is this prosecution legitimate especially . Raising it from a misdemeanor to a felony. I think its pretty sketchy. I really do. I think on the salacious stuff, the affairs, the cover up, all i think he is guilty but i dont think any anybody but for other than donald trump would ever have this case brought against them and its theres something unseemly about having during a prosecutor who basically campaigned and promised to go after a single man, Ben Fold Mutilate and twist the law to go after donald trump and is it legitimate . I mean, if it were illegitimate, the courts would throw it out as like you can bring this. So its legitimate and the very technical sense i think its a bad idea. Nir, let me pick up on that. The fed is considered this case before are dropping it. The das predecessor considered this case before dropping it. So do you think those trials monday as legit . Well, listen, its certainly salacious to jonas, 0. 11 going to be i think horror to find a jury that takes it as seriously, i think as the prosecutors want them to take it, its kind of a complicated case, right . Its fall allegedly falsifying Business Records. And then in advance of breaking Campaign Finance law and obviously, if hes convicted on all of these counts, i think its something i like 30 then there could be serious jail time. Thats very doubtful. I think in the minds of most voters, this is the most petty trial that he faces. There are more serious ones. January 1 that we know is going to happen before they its going to be two months and hes gonna be trapped in a courtroom for that time. So there are two aspects this trial, as weve laid out, the strength of the legal case and all the stuff that will come out about Stormy Daniels and also karen mcdougal, a playboy model who trump allegedly had an affair with and money was paid to eliana how badly do you think the combination of sleaze . And a possible convection will hurt trump. Well, theyre two separate things we are not learning about new slays in this case, there is nothing in this case were going to learn about trumps character that is going to shock and scandalize the American Public everything he does is public. We know everything about this, so i dont think thats going to move the needle and then on the matter of a conviction, maybe that moves the needle and i actually i think neha, theres more of a little bit more of a risk for him. I think hes going to face a very hostile jury in manhattan that may actually convict him. In terms of proving the case, i think thats a little bit harder because theyre going to have to prove that trump rather than some junior, some Junior Employee in trump tower who actually entered this in terms of like entered the Business Record that he had control over how it was entered. An intern terms of the Business Records falsify, just jump in just very briefly though, and just say, i dont think that thats true this is the whole thing that everyone always says about trump wouldve never going to learn anything new about. And we already know all the terrible things that hes or what is this case actually going to do . Having him sit in a courtroom, even though this is not going to be televised, which i think was a mistake. But even so, its going to get an enormous amount of scrutiny, he is going to be sitting in this courtroom when he should be campaigning. And that is what people are going to be hearing instead of his ideas for the country that will hurt him. But i dont think theres anything like were not learning anything new about what he did with reminding people of how sorted truly, how sorted, truly, some of trump still are i think the chaos around donald trump that weve obviously seen while he was in office out of office. And i can make that kind of idea. Listen some people say, well, listen is its going to hurt him with any sector of voters, particularly the angelic goals. I would say no, they liked him, no matter what they obviously all know about this possible allianz that he had with a porn star. So in that aspect, i dont think itll hurt them, but i think in general with voters, it wont help. Lets put it like that, which certainly wont help. Then theres a bortion from said this week that abortion should be left to the states, but less than 24 hours later, arizona reinstated of 160 yearold law, banning all hello, except to save the life of the mother. And that had trumped doing Damage Control everybody else bring it back into reason here lulu trunk reportedly thought that it was safer to take the states Rights Argument rather than a lot of people thought he was going to do a national ban, but he was afraid, allegedly that he would then own that. But given the fact of what happened in arizona 24 hours later, is he off the hook on a board . Question no. Hes really not off the hook on abortion. In fact, that was the gift that kept up that is going to keep on giving throughout the campaign. I mean, the very fact that arizona has now resurrected a law from the 1800s at a time when actually it wasnt even a state. This law was enacted by one white man back then. I mean, its the whole thing is absolutely insane that women in this day and age are now held hostage by laws. Two centuries ago what i will also say is that no one believes at this point. I think the donald trump, when he is an office, if he indeed becomes president , again, is not going to back whatever his supporters wanted back. And there is a very big plant and for there to be federal and actions of things like the comstock act, which is another law from the 1800s. Let me bring jonah into this, and thats why i wonder about the wisdom of having decided to go the states rights rude wont he now have to answer for any restriction in any state and there are a bunch of them. Yeah. Look, im actually do you very sympathetic to the states Rights Argument, but i think hes im not running for president. And so he the problem of when abortion in arizona takes a very strong prolife position. He has to condemn it, which is going to annoy pro lifers when another state, somebody asked you about that states rights. And then as soon as arizona takes a position, he says, change it, right . So this is this is the dilemma hes got gotten themselves into, as you say, is a he has to comment on every single thing that happens if theres a very prochoice law that comes up. Hes going to have to comment on that if theres a very prolife wall that comes up, hes going to comment on that. So all hes done is create a cycle of constant new news pegs that talk about abortion. And thats the one thing he didnt want to talk about. One thing trump is very clear about wants to debate joe biden and several News Networks this week urge them to do it but biden share the stage with those election denying rival also ahead for push the liberal Supreme Court justice some on the left hope will step down and later a jump ball for the panel on webber Womens College basketball will continue to serve post Caitlin Clark are you up big Caitlin Clark fein, you know, im a carolina fan you had because i because i grew up in South Carolina theres debris in the guy. Parents, husbands and wives, sky, i wish i couldve done something differently. You can just make it better for those that follow Space Shuttle columbia, the final flight, two part finale tomorrow at nine on cnn. If youre looking for a Medicare SupplementInsurance Plan thats smart now, im 65 and really smart leader. Im 70. 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The question, justice rational left that would you in that moment four years ago, one of the 145 times donald trump interrupted during the first debate of 2020. I think that the country would be better served if we allowed both people to speak with fuel were interruptions. Im appealing to you, sir, to do that. Well, and him to well. Frankly, youve been doing more interruptive a stark departure from the decorum of the first televised debate ever in 1960 the things that senator kennedy has said, many of us can agree with, i think mr. Nixon is an effective leader of his party. Yet, despite the unseemly face soft the last cycle the worst. Whereas in america has ever had five major tv networks, including cnn, have drafted a Letter Urging both menn to do it. Again, saying there is simply no substitute for the candidates debating with each other on the trail, trump is demanding a rematch. Followed on cookie joe to debate any any place, but biden has been on committal. Depends on his behavior may a given trumps behavior back in the 2020 debate, which i remember very vividly and his pension for telling untruths. How do you feel about the news media pushing for debates . Well, listen, i mean, they have to write this is a tradition for News Organizations to want to debate. There are lots of eyeballs that go into it, but i think were trying to like Graphed Normal Political Forums and to abnormal times in an abnormal candidate, trump is a liar and hes a Conspiracy Theorist as well. And i think, you know, News Organizations should consider maybe, maybe there shouldnt be debates at this Point Given Who donald trump is as a candidate, john, what do you think of that argument that the networks by pushing for the debates are trying to normalize at least in one case, a candidate who has anything but normal oh, i understand. Its not like but its t likeenot gonna be a lite coracy theories and craziness Intthe Puic Discourse is the republican nominee. Hes the former president in states. He has lots of venues to be able to do that. Look, i agree theres no substitute for president ial debates in the same way, theres no substitute for a fight between a monkey and a hawk. I mean, its like theres nothing like it. It doesnt necessarily mean it actually adds a lot to civic discourse or understanding but its the job of political journalists to be in effect as david broder said, fight promoters. And this is just good box office, so it doesnt surprise me that the media wants, its good box office, but it is the time when most voters actually two i mean, you see the numbers people really do 80,000,070, 7,080 million. What gets those numbers other than the super bowl anymore . And this is the one, but this is the one moment where people really are going to be focusing on what these two people are saying. And yes, is trumping wrangle proof clearly not. I mean, look what happened to chris. I mean, its hard oh but it is important that he actually sit and debate present totally agree like we should, we should b