i know he was a very involved with a lot of governors every step of the way. certainly like new york and some of the states that have the nursing home policy, he was intimately involved in things like that but he was a big believer in the hospital models that was funded by bill gates and those models were grievously wrong. but i know he was a believer in that. he was also a believer in the imperial college model that neil ferguson had done, which was disastrously wrong and because a lot of panic both in the united kingdom and united states. >> laura: did you any point believe that it was an error to have given him this much power in the way of media presence and the briefings every day? and did you share that concern with anybody at the white house? >> i did show the concentric i think there's a lot of concern at the white house as well. you know, the problem, laura, is to elevate anybody like that, i think is problematic.