i think that i've actually written on the subject and done some research. if you read the debates of the constitutional framework, they did not anticipate a president would pardon himself. at all. that is language that suggests to the contrary. but i think that the pardon of richard nixon was interrupted the process, and caused gerald ford to be defeated. and if people think that ron desantis, donald trump, that they could get away with this, they can. can't. actually, the pardon itself might be an abuse of power and impeachable offense, if not a crime. >> let's take a quick break. i want to continue this conversation, because, lacey brought up the judge in this case and how that may be complicating things. we've talked about the fact that a potential pardon attempt could be headed to the supreme courts, if that is the case, i want to discuss both of those things with you on the other
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