President itself wants to do the interview and its only his lawyers holding him back. So what is really going on here . Does the president want to talk or not . Politico suggests the answer is yes. Despite the risks. Thats because of, quote, trumps belief in his selfcreated myth, that he can convince anyone of anything if hes simply given the opportunity to get them in a room alone. Apparently that includes Special Counsel bob mueller himself. I want to bring in nbcs Peter Alexander whos live in berkeley heights, new jersey. Peter, if the president really wants to do it, he could just say yes. I mean, his legal take is working for him. So whats going on here . Yes, chris, you make a very good point. There would be one easy way for Rudy Giuliani and, frankly, President Trump, to wrap this thing up sooner. Giuliani saying he wants it to end within the next three weeks, by september 1st. He doesnt want it to interfere with the november elections. They would sit down with robert
mueller. The president certainly could do that if he so chose. But instead what weve sort of witnessed is what appears to be a very sort of public stalling game, a Public Mudslinging Effort by Rudy Giuliani. And the president s legal team. Broadly, they are able to monopolize the air waves right now because Robert Mueller, the Special Counselor, his team, they are not speaking publicly. Instead weve heard from giuliani as a variety of occasions as you noted over the last several months doing whats sort of a delicate dance. Publicly negotiating, more often commentating. Describing in multiple occasions this investigation is illegitimate. Saying theres a lot of Bad Information about Robert Mueller here that hasnt gotten out yet without giving any specific details about it, effectively saying its going to blow up in Robert Muellers face. A lot of this appears to be an effort to really rile up some of the president s base of supporters here. In effect, inoculate him against whatever the ultimate findings are in this situation. But hes also said what appears
witch hunt. His sense of let me stop you because it raises an interesting question. If the president really does believe, and i think most folks do buy into this, he believes he can convince anybody of anything. Its why, right, he went to sit down with leaders of authoritarian countries. Because he thought he could change the equation just by a facetoface meeting. Are his lawyers worried . Are the people around him who dont want him to talk to mueller worried that in a split moment, he can agree to something just because that part of his personality becomes dominant . Yes, the dominant part of his personality that worried his attorneys the most is his ability or his tendency to really stretch the truth. This is a person who has great connecti economic data, who has to go further and say its the best and record setting economic d a data. A guy who sold his building by saying it was ten stories higher than it was. When they talk about perjury traps, you dont get trapped into perjury. Thats rhetoric meant for the public to believe the idea that somehow theyre trying to trick donald trump. No one has to trick or dupe this president when it comes to getting him to stretch the truth. To go beyond the truth. The difference here is that the stakes for the president , for his family, for his associates, the legal stakes, are much higher than anywhere else. I think even though the president may have this belief in his ability to go and set things straight in person, his attorneys and the people around him are really concerned about him doing that. Let me go back to the Special Counsel and play part of what Rudy Giuliani had to say on fox news. Take a listen. He knows the answers to every question that he wants to ask. Hes going to ask them, did you teleco tell comey to go easy . No, he didnt. He wanted to get him under oath to trap him into perjury. Were not going to let you do that. What does Robert Mueller want from President Trump . Well, in this case, bob mueller wants to know what exactly President Trump was thinking when he said these things. I dont think theres any dispute about at least the thrust of what was said. Weve heard from jim comey under oath. Before congress. And mueller has heard the same thing presumably from comey and his team about what exactly President Trump said. What bob mueller and his team want to know is what exactly was going through trumps head. Was there some sort of criminal intent when he said these things to jim comey about michael flynn, when he was interacting with others that are central to this Obstruction Investigation . Unless there is a smoking gun email that is written by President Trump that seems to convey his deepest innermost thoughts, that says when i told jim comey to let this flynn thing go, i was trying to
obstruct justice. I dont think the muller team is going to be satisfied because thats precisely what theyre looking for. They need to go beyond exactly what was said to determine exactly what he was thinking. So a. B. , let me go back to this whole idea of President Trump and what he wants and whats likely to happen here. This whole idea that he simply has to get somebody in a room and he can convince them of anything, where does that take him in terms of the Robert Mueller investigation . Well, i think what eli was laying out is theres two things. That is true that he does believe, as you said, if its kim jongun or Vladimir Putin. If he gets somebody alone, hes going to get his way, hes going to convince them of his truth. The other thing is, not only does he lie a lot, sometimes he tells the truth. Like to your own lester holt of nbc news when he said i was thinking about this russia thing, i was going to fire him anyway. His lawyers are afraid not only he might lie under oath, but that he might just give away the store. The bigger danger is he
he makes up his own facts whenever he wants. But i do think the point that a. B. Makes is the most important one. Trump went on national tv, on nbc news, and basically to a lot of people admitted obstruction of justice. That he had the Mueller Probe in mind when he fired the director of the fbi. My view has always been that trumps lawyers will never, ever let him sit down with Robert Mueller and testify, no matter what he wants. He may want one day to clear his name and have this interview, the next day feel nervous about it and think hes going to trip himself up. But i never believe they would allow him to sit down with mueller and potentially contradict himself, perjure himself, go off on some tangent. Theres way too much risk involved. They are delaying. They do want to get it closer to the midterm elections at which point he couldnt issue a subpoena because theyll be in this quiet period. I think they want to take it as close to november, not get a Subpoena Fight until after the midterms, and then e think you would actually have a Subpoena Fight which is a huge legal
battle. Mueller has three choices, he can keep negotiations, he can issue a subpoena. Thats exactly right. On the part of Rudy Giuliani, this is classic rudy. In the sense hes saying one thing and doing another thing entirely. He and his team have been saying for months now, some nine months, they want to wrap this thing up. Remember, this was supposed to be concluded by christmas, christmas of 2017, christmas of last year. Were now in august. But i think theyve actually reached the point where theyve develop add new strategy and their strategy now is to say they want to get this wrapped up. Say they want to get this over with. But actually to extend it. To make it longer. Because they have found that its actually a winning issue with trumps base. They can portray this thing as a witch hunt. They can galvanize trumps most ardent supporters and actually use this to bring them out, to energize them, to make them thing, to dupe them into thinking that the government, that some sort of deep state
kabal some deep state can save the president . They think its one. This is one they actually want to see continue through the fall. So that they can use this. And i do agree i think the most likely Subpoena Option is likely to come after the midterms, not before. I dont think that the special Prosecutors Office would risk that cataclysmic showdown in the midst of election season, knowing precisely what jim comey did and precisely how he has been raked over the coals ever since. There was another point last night that was interesting. Giuliani appeared to a lot of folks to be threatening Robert Mueller. The real story here is not that this case isnt going to fizzle. Its going to blow up on them. The real question is what we talked about before, theres a lot more to what they did that nobody knows about yet. And mueller is going to have a lot to answer for. What do you make of that . Its the typical projection that you hear from the president and the people around him all the time. You know, and its very vague. Youll find out the terrible things they did. I mean, if they had terrible things to say or allegations against the Special Counsel, they would just say them right now. This is all sort of, again, for public consumption and trying to bias the public to say to believe that the probe is somehow out to get the president and, again, as peter said, the Special Counsels Office Doesnt Comment on this stuff publicly so you have rudy and jay sekulow basically filling the airways and trying to respond in a political way to this legal matter and thats been their strategy. Up next, any minute now, day eight of the manafort trials going to kick off with the big question lingering. Did the prosecution possibly overplay its hand with their star witness, rick gates . Plus, a defiant Chris Collinssays he will neither step down, nor stop running for reelection. Calling questions of insider tradiing meritless. Then this video shows the congressman at the white house glued to his phone at the exact time prosecutors allege he was sharing inside information. While nbc has this video, Stephen Colbert and The Late Show explained what they say is exclusive audio from the call. The late show has acquired the audio. Jim, enhance. Hello, sell, sell, sell, sell, sell, sell this is Chris Collins sell, sell, sell no, well never get caught sell my life is here. [telephone ring] ahoyhoy. Alexander graham bell here. No, no, my number is one, you must want two two, i say
like my father before. [telephone ring] like my father before. Ahoyhoy as long as people talk too loudly on the phone, you can count on geico saving folks money. Fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. Of four Extramarital Affairs and Defense Attorneys reminding the jury how gates lied to Special Counsel mueller. Nbcs justice reporter Julia Ainsley joins me now. This is one of those cases that actually may kind of live up to what we watch on tv. Theres so many moments that are, like, wow. So im reading reports that are pretty dramatic of yesterday. It was striking i felt the way the New York Times put it. Manaforts lawyers attacked gates as a thief, a Serial Adulter and possible forger. So it does seem now youve got the strong paper trail, the Defense Strategy is what, to undercut gates credibility . Is that the hart of the case basically . Yes, if that was their big play, they certainly played it yesterday. They started a tacking not only who he was as a person but also who he was as a business partner. Talking about how he embezzled hundreds of thousands of dollars
and was someone who could not be trusted. One of the things they brought up was how many times you met with Special Counsel before you started testifying. He said 20 times. Its kind of hard to believe. If he met with him 20 times, its clear why he couldnt just say yes, i lied to the fbi. That was a thing he bleeded guilty to months ago. Its unclear why he seemed kind of shaky. Then yesterday they both up this bombshell, saying did you have up to four affairs and did you talk to the Special Counsel . Before he could answer, he was then cut off, through an objection. We didnt get to hear the answer to that. Rick gates is now off the stand. Were moving into more of documen documentheavy part of the case. Well hear from more Tax Preparers and accountants we believe. We mentioned the irs agent. There was also an fbi Forensic Accountant. What was this back and forth about, about a manafort signature . Thats right. So part of the Paper Trail Argument is that manaforts lawyers were able to bring up two pieces to this Forensic Accountant had gone through, which proved the accounts had been signed by manafort. But he brought up two signatures that did look different. He even brought up third and fourth signatures. She kept saying, im not a handwriting expert, so how could i really know what whether or not this is a different person. I can sign my signature different from day to day. That was one thing they used not just to undermine gates but to undermine the paper trail, which is at the heart of the prosecutions argument. You know how sometimes you have to sign on the computer or when youre, like, at a store or something . I dont even recognize my own signature. Julia ainsley, appreciate it. Up next, reality star turned white house aide omarosa set to release an explosive new book. And in the prepublication push,
reports surface she was secretly recording the president inside the white house. And later, a small town taking a big hit from the trade wars. Why one South Carolina company says it cant stay in business as long as the president s tariffs are in place. Like, 126 people eating lunch here this week. And you pull them out next week and theyre not eating lunch. Thats a definite detriment to any community. Come here, babe. Nasty Nighttime Heartburn . Try new alkaseltzer pm gummies. The only fast, Powerful Heartburn Relief Plus Melatonin so you can fall asleep quickly. Oh, what a relief it is monitor their Blood Glucose every day. Which means they have to stop. And stick their fingers. Repeatedly. Today, lifechanging technology from abbott makes it possible to track glucose levels. Without drawing a drop of blood, again and again. The most personal technology, is technology with the power to change your life. Life. To the fullest. At the Marine Mammal center, the environment is everything. We want to do our very best for each and every animal, and we want to operate a sustainable facility. And pg e has been a partner helping us to achieve that. Weve helped the Marine Mammal center go solar, install electric vehicle charging stations, and become more energy efficient. Pg e has allowed us to be the most
sustainable organization we can be. Any time you help a customer, its a really good feeling. Its especially so when its a customer thats doing such good and important work for the environment. Together, were building a better california. Defiance today from new york republican congressman Chris Collins, vowing to continue his Reelection Campaign and fight federal charges of insider trading. The charges have that been levied against me are meritless and i will mount a vigorous defense in court to clear my name. I look forward to being fully vindicated and exonerated, ending any and all questions relating to my affiliation. Allege that collins used Insider Information he got as a board member for an australian
bio tech firm to help his family make trades and avoid losing 700,000. The republican has been one of the president s most vocal supporters. He was actually the first member of congress to endorse him in 2016. Daily beast Reporter Justin Glau has been following this story and joins me now. Lay out the Prosecution Case for us. They have emails from innates ceo to collins, essentially saying their loan product what they expected to make millions and tens of millions of dollars on had failed. And then the prosecution after that then has phone calls that collins made to his son and and that video, i mean, its at the white house and theres a video and the timing there it is. Pretty much exactly when they say that those phone calls were happening, right . Yes, its pretty stunning this guy i mean, this is pretty clear cut insider trading
case. He had material nonpublic information. He gave it to his son who then used that information to make a trade that he otherwise would