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Sometimes people say things but do they mean it? >> i don't think -- and in this case, because really, like when you look at it, so much can change, i'm not in the prediction business, but there's a very good chance we could have another biden-trump matchup. that's just, you know, the facts of the matter. >> i joked with my team when i saw that poll come out over the weekend. did we need a poll to tell us this? i mean, look at how both of them are deeply unpopular with segments of the american people and you're spot on in many ways, are they really ready to quit these two men? i think both of ...

That i have seen. that is quoted in our next guest, ezra klein's, brilliant new article about what real political engagement requires. it requires direct support of candidates through contributions or knocking on doors. it requires voting and helping others vote. and it requires running for office and understanding that no elected office is unimportant. ezra klein reports on ben wickler, chair of the democratic party, spends his days obsessing over mayoral races in towns because those clerks decide whether to pull the drop boxes for hail-in ballots and small changes to electoral administration...

Democrats across the country are warning of looming threats to the Affordable Care Act ahead of this year's midterms, returning to an issue that drove them to success in 2018.

Accused of intimidating minority and democratic voters. that's who wisconsin republicans have just given subpoena power to, to cast doubt on the presidential election results in wisconsin, which i should note joe biden won by a not inconsiderable margin. joining us now is ben wickler, the chairman of the wisconsin democratic party. mr. wickler, it's nice to see you. thank you for joining us tonight. >> it's great to see you, rachel. >> looking in from the outside, this feels both in keeping with what we've seen in other states, including arizona, and it also feels weirder and smaller. can you ...

Own funds to pay for copying and binding some copies of his bogus report which he then delivered himself to the heads of the state democratic and republican parties. his boss then banned him from visiting the polls on election day in 2008, after which he quit the police force to go work for a texas-based tea party group that sends conservative partisan poll watchers to the polls on election day and that has been accused of intimidating minority and democratic voters. that's who wisconsin republicans have just given subpoena power to, to cast doubt on the presidential election results in wiscon...