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There's some -- a lot of this has been kind of -- we've heard the basic outlines of this plan, the competing electors, what pence would do, what trump was urging him to do. that element of it, the post 1/6 kind of anticipating this might not work but could still work in a way, that was novel to me. are there other things in this memo that struck you as surprising and illuminating of what was intended here by the coup plotters? >> you know, i'm with you, john, on the parts that are striking. the aftermath of how maybe we could still keep donald trump as president or maybe we could still keep in...

What took place here. as i said that includes i think debates on the house floor, potentially on january 6th." jordan meant what he said. on january 5th we now know he forwarded a text message to white house chief of staff mark meadows encouraging vice president pence to just overturn the election single-handedly, throw out the will of the voters and essentially pave the way to install trump as the winner. on the day itself january 6th meadows was one of -- jordan was one of 147 members of congress who voted not to seat the electors. that's not all. the committee also wants to know if jordan w...

Say no one is above the law. there are two possibilities here. one is that merrick garland has a secret investigation into trump and the other coup plotters and we just don't know about it. the second is that garland is too afraid of his shadow and doing nothing. as we think about, nicolle, which of these possibilities is right, i think there are three things to consider. first, it's really obvious that an investigation into the higher ups including trump and his coup plotters is required for all the reasons you were just saying to the congressman. a criminal statute makes that kinds of behavi...

The coup plotters around him like steve bannon, like jeff clark who tried to become attorney general. congress is looking at them to try to figure out what's happened. we don't have any evidence thus far that the justice department as opened an investigation into that. from my perspective, that's what i worry so that about. it may by that's happening. we have a great attorney general that i think is running this investigation, but there aren't any signs right now that that investigation is reaching the higher ups. that, to me, is the doomsday scenario, to basically tell all these coup plotters...

Department goes for that. will donald trump himself be brought into a conspiracy charge? do they believe that they can actually charge him with a crime? but there is a lot here for them to work with. >> yeah, i mean that is a 364,000 dollar question. i know in other countries that can sometimes happen. the coup plotters, and they're usually charged. that's the way it usually goes. you don't try and they say don't do that again. that's pretty standard in the post coup record book but we will see if that happens here. caroline frederiksen thank you very much. >> thank you for having me. >> next ...