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Why haven't they passed the bill today? keep watching tonight. they aren't going to pass it and they probably won't vote until late. it's embarrassing for speaker boehner and the conservative movement. >> i think ron's information is very interesting if it's correct. i mean, we are watching dysfunctional government in action. i always said the deciding factor to whether we're going off the cliff or not once they started actually moving toward a balanced compromise, which we really did see earlier this week, was a test of whether john boehner could bring his troops along. i was always skeptical...

The president has kept the dell ceiling as part of this deal. so the idea that the president hasn't brought real compromise to this table is upside down. >> ron, we just had congressman charles rangel on the broadcast. he agreed that speaker boehner has been hopeless and should resign. does speaker boehner have the votes tonight and if he doesn't, should he resign? >> no, he doesn't have the votes yet. from my latest count, i have been talking to people who know the vote count. looks like there's about 30 and 45 conservative votes against this bill which means it won't pass. speaker boehner ne...

Real problem, and that's the national debt. cutting a trillion dollars in the next ten years does nothing and leaves the whole bill on the next generation on younger people, on my generation, to pick up the tab for obama's spending and bush's spending by the way and that's not right. and that's not serious. >> ron, i'm going to come back to you in a moment about speaker boehner, but, jared, he's suggesting that the president has not offered us a balanced plan. >> not only has the president gone beyond a balanced plan, but john boehner had a balanced plan or something a lot -- >> what does bala...

Joining us now is ron meier, spokesperson for american majority action and jared bernstein a senior fellow and an msnbc contributor. welcome to you both. jared, this plan b, it's not only an affront to what the president has been trying to do in terms of a balanced approach. it's also a colossal waste of time, isn't it? >> absolutely. i mean, i have been writing about this in terms of theatrics at a time when really nobody ought to be going to the theater. the fiscal cliff is way too close for this type of game playing and i just noted today that the gdp report for the third quarter got a litt...

0 starting to look likely we go past january 1st on this. >> happy christmas, mike. thanks so much. now we turn to congressman charles rangel, a democrat of new york. sir, i put to you the question we started with, the clock is ticking to the new year. here comes the fiscal cliff. so what on earth is the speaker, mr. boehner and his boys, what on earth are they doing wasting time on these gyrations as harry reid referred to them? >> the best i can make out is that he doesn't have the votes to do what he would want to do, and that he's using these legislative procedures in order to test the m...