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Years? democracy is in play. you cannot be anymore severe or passionate. anybody that doesn't get that has got their head up their butt. >> certainly there is that idea that if the president is impeached here, is not removed and then wins re-election, how does that embolden him going forward when he never has to face voters again? >> go ahead, michael. >> i was going to say, you know, based on everything that's said around the table, here is where i come down on this. and this is really a question to will herd and everyone else who just have seen and heard everything that we have seen and hear...

Proceed. admiral, let's go to you on this. what are the implications of the president of the united states putting his thumb on the scale and inserting himself into this? >> well, let's start with the basics here, which is that all of these cases, there's been a whole veefrs them nseries of th the president has come into the process and issued a pardon or clemency if the clemency. in all of those cases, these were crimes that were uncovered by fellow s.e.a.l.s and green berets who turned in these people. that's how we got here. and then those people were convicted in the ultimate jury of their...

The president of the united states to step into a case like this and to, that in fact, hand down a directive to the navy? >> it's extremely rare. it does occur, you see it just like you do in the civilian world, willie, you see where a president and all presidents have done this, issue pardons along the way. but in the military, because we have our own system of justice with the investigators, the juries, the judges are all military, it's very rare for a president to step into that process. and in the context of this particular case, to step in in what are convictions for war crimes. i can't r...

Process and the law. and the republicans know that. and their long term game and their short-term game is to wear this thing down to the point when it gets to the senate there's no runway left. and mitch mcconnell has two very important options, one, not to even hold a trial because the evidence coming from the house isn't sustainable, or, two, to hold it but then we know what the vote's going to be because it's already locked and loaded. and so those moments like yesterday i thought reflected that reality for a lot of republicans. it was like, okay, well, we're done. you know, so let's take o...

Wlars widepositions, what will have been the significance of this process for you? >> the think the failure to impose consequences on the president here for his being able to demand of a foreign country for a personal political benefit in exwhichange for what another country wants, other countries take lessons from this. so the chinese to lift tariffs that american farmers suffer with. other countries, the europeans, the north koreans, they know now one of the things they can put on the table to get the things that they want are personal political benefits for this president. and what we've se...