Transcripts For MSNBCW Alex 20240703

Mitt romney on our youtube page. Go to msnbc. Com stephanie. And guess what . We have a great lineup for the night cap. If you have a hot date and cant watch, youre in luck. You can catch it again on saturday at 11 00 p. M. Eastern right here on msnbc. And on that note, i wish you all a very good night. From all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news, thanks for staying up late. Ill see you at the end of tomorrow. After another day of major testimony in Donald Trumps first criminal trial. Michael cohen, trumps former lawyer and fixer was back on the stand today. Facing crossexamination from Donald Trumps current lawyer todd blanche. For anyone who is counting mr. Cohen has been on the stand for more than 14 hours with more to come on monday. And nearly all day today, todd blanche tried to undermine mr. Cohens credibility as a witness. Blanche spent half the morning recalling different episodes when Michael Cohen lied publicly. Lied to congress. Lying in court. Lying about whether or not he sought a pardon. Essentially forcing cohen to admit repeatedly that he has been untruthful. Blanche also tried to paint cohen as something of a renegade. A man who spent the 2016 Election Cycle Casting out on his own. Speaking to the press publicly and privately without Donald Trumps consent or supervision. He tried to call into question Michael Cohens memory. And that built into what was probably the biggest moment of today when the defense managed to cast out on a key part of cohens story. Now, to understand exactly what happened today, you have to go back to 2016. When donald trump was running an unusually Lean Campaign for president. And one of his unlikely Campaign Surrogates was his personal attorney. Michael cohen. These are Donald Trumps words. He is going to stay true to who he is. And he is going to end up winning this election in all fairness. He is a mentor. He is a sage. He is like family. I have worked for mr. Trump a long time and i can tell you that mr. Trumps memory is fantastic. I have never come across a situation where he said something that is not accurate. Seriously . Yes, seriously. Seriously . And that same period, campaign surrogate Michael Cohen was allegedly also negotiating the Stormy Daniels Hush Money Payment on Donald Trumps behalf. But because Michael Cohen was publicly associated with the trump campaign, going on cable news to attest to trumps Sterling Recollection of facts and honesty. Because Michael Cohen was one of the public faces of the campaign, Michael Cohen was also being harassed by members of the public. Specifically in the weeks before the election, Michael Cohen was getting Prank Phone Calls from someone who claim today be a 14yearold kid. On october 24th, 2016, cohen texted trumps body man Keith Schiller to report the prank caller to the Secret Service. Which okay. Trumps body man wrote back call me. Which he did. The two men spoke for about a minuteandahalf. Now the problem for Michael Cohen here is he previously testified that minuteanda half phone call was actually a call where Keith Schiller gave his phone to donald trump and he updated trump about the Stormy Daniels conversation. Todd blanche seized on that potential disparity to attack Michael Cohen. It was one of the few moments in the trial where todd blanche has expressed any emotion. Here he is. That was a lie. You didnt talk to president trump, you talked to keith about the prank phone call. Cohen, im not certain that is accurate. Blanche, you were certain when you were under oath testifying. Cohen, based on the records i reviewed and in light of everything going on, i believe i spoke to mr. Trump about the Stormy Daniels matter. Blanche, we are not hearing your belief. That was arguably the best attack on his credibility. But well see. Other than that. The most meaningful thing the defense did was drag this whole thing out. For the entire second half of the crossexamination, todd blanche appeared to be playing for time stretching the Cross Examination to the end of the day. Now court is not in session tomorrow. So, donald trump can attend his sons High School Graduation and then quickly leave baron on Graduation Night to go to a fundraiser in minneapolis 1700 miles away. Every family celebrates differently. That means the jury will now sit with Michael Cohens testimony for three days which is either a good thing or a bad thing. On the one hand, the jury will be spending the entire weekend talking about the defenses First Successful attack on cohen. And we may be nearing the end of this whole thing. The judge told both side to be prepare today give their Closing Arguments as soon as next tuesday. Michael cohen will be the last witness for the prosecution. As far as the defense goes, we still do not know which witnesses they will call, if any. The defense still does not know if it is going to call the only Expert Witness on its list. And expert on election law. But there is some speculation that the defense may try to call a witness who is not on their list. A trump attorney who was close to Rudy Giuliani and dispatched in 2018 to try and keep Michael Cohen in line. So it seems that trumps defense is making decisions on the fly. Including the biggest decision of all. Today trumps attorneys told the court that they still do not know if donald trump will take the stand. Joan joining me now are my great colleagues. Rachel maddow and lawrence odonnell. It is a pleasure to have you both. The conventional wisdom is todd blanche had a better day than he has. What is your assessment . I think your observation he seemed to be playing for time is a good assessment because everybody who i have seen direct reporting including our own Staff Members were all remarking throughout the course of the day, where is this going. Where is this going. Not only was there no sort of cinematic or dramatic rhythm to it. It just kind of sprawled. That said, he did seem to catch Michael Cohen in a bit of a cul desac on this question of whether or not one particular conversation that cohen recounted. Whether one particular conversation with trump actually happened the way cohen remembered it. I say it is just one conversation with trump. Because i think it is important that that particular phone call wasnt like the lynch pin of his testimony or the prosecutions case. This one call was one of the communications he described in which he updated trump on the status of the hush money case. It is not a key matter. By trying to shake Michael Cohens memory loose and question whether or not that call went down the way cohen said it did. They are trying to stick a pry bar in that crack and mess him up as a witness and make it seem like nothing he said can be trusted at all. And that is certainly a real legal tactic. Thats a thing that happens on crossexamination. It appears to be the only thing they have accomplished on Cross Examination. It will be interesting to see if this is effectively their whole defense against this whole case for donald trump. A prank phone call. All of this rests, lets just talk about how it landed at the courtroom. Lawrence. Because the transcript reads that Michael Cohen sticks to his line effectively. He does not capitulate. But because todd blanche showed emotion and was on attack mode in a way he hasnt been, it is seen as a win. How did it feel to you . Let me first of all try to get control of this emotion thing. We have all heard tv shows, tv political chat shows, where it is louder and angrier than what he did. So yeah. It was the loudest todd blanche has been and the loudest voice i have heard in that courtroom but this is the most mild mannered courtroom i have ever been in. Including Michael Cohen and especially the judge and the other lawyers so there was a certain amount of excitement. The reporters heard something finally that sounded really dramatic. And it did. And it was extremely effective. And one reason why it was, it was a surprise. This was not a piece that the District Attorney had prepared us for. The crank caller we found out about in crossexamination. We didnt know about the crank caller on direct examination. So we are all sitting there learning about this crank caller who turns out to be 14 years old. And Michael Cohen handles it kind of generously for him once he found out it is a 14year old kid. But he was trying to scare the kid. The Secret Service is. Cooing after you. So what it eventually became is that okay. The call that i made to keith at 8 302. Earlier tonight, i reread that with the District Attorney. What happened today doesnt contradict what he said. It amplifies it. So yeah. I called Keith Schillar right in the middle of that Harassment Business and yes, i said something to keith about the harassment. What do we do about that. And then he handed the phone to donald trump. And then i said to him, we got to wrap up the Stormy Daniels thing. And all of that happens in a minute and 32. It can happen in a minute and 32. Especially when Donald Trumps responses in these dialogues in other spots include lines like just do it. Thats good. And the just do it line becomes before this phone call happens. This phone call is not the only testimony about donald trump ordering this payoff to Stormy Daniels which causes the false Business Records to be created. Which is what by the way, the trial is about false Business Records. Theres 34. Todd blanche hasnt mentioned one of them. Has he had a good day . As long as you count the day as 10 minutes but i will say theless of his day was effective because it was messy. The da did this chronologically. He just rambled all over different dates and thats a smart move. Because it makes Michael Cohens lying chaotic whereas in the das version of it, you understood his profession was lying for donald trump in house for donald trump. Whether it be to Gossip Magazines or for a political candidate. And then there comes a time where his lying for donald trump gets him indicted. And now you have him in this weird cross fire of his own lies. When you hear it in that biographical way it was told by the prosecution, it makes sense. It is chaotic lying. It was a smart move. The defense has not focused on i dont know why donald trump would be paying 35,000 a month in installments. And they havent gotten to the essence of the charges. They have focused on the Credibility Issue and i was reminded of something the judge said about Michael Cohens credibility in the civil fraud case. This is in his ruling. The fact finder does not believe that pleading guilty to perjury means you can never tell the truth. Its a simple concept. But it could hold up here. A, he could have been lying about other things and not the things he has testified to. That can exist. The other thing, and this might be what the prosecution is, when they conceded. Yeah. Michael cohen, controversial guy. But everything important, you have corroborated. We have other Witness Testimony and documents and ways to prove to you that the important things he is going to say are things that actually happened and that we can bolster from other sources. So the prosecution has been prepared for months and months for the whole defense mounted against this case on trumps behalf to be Michael Cohen is a liar. If that is what they are trying to do, if that is what they are tripling down on, if that is the only defense they will amount here, ultimately, what the jury is being told is donald trump hired a guy who is a real bully and a liar to do his work for him and had him work for him doing that. By the way, the underlying scheme that is being charged here as a felony is effectively a lie when you are paying hush money to somebody, you are telling them to lie by omission. By not tell a true story. Because you dont want it to get out for other purposes. If what they are proving is donald trump has a way of doing business, had somebody on his payroll whose job was professionally to lie and intimidate people and that was in effect a description of the understood lying conduct that led to the charges. Im not sure the jury has a great revelation. About oh no, theres a liar in this room. It is as helpful to the prosecution as it is the defense. That is such an astute point. Lying liars and the people who lie. Lawrence, did you get a sense that the killing time was really another part of their strategy in all of this . It is not killing time. It is entertaining donald trump. So Donald Trumps definition of torture on a Witness Stand is just being on a Witness Stand. Which is why he never does it so he thinks every minute you are on the Witness Stand is hell so his demand from his lawyers is simply make sure it is hell for those people on the Witness Stand. Who testify against me. So it is a risky thing for lawyers. Because jurors catch on when you are treading water and they dont like it but i dont think todd blanche has reached that point. I think he kept it aalive enough today. The fact he kept jumping around was helpful to keep people alert. And he did something lawyers never get to do in trial. He surprised everyone. This 14yearold Phone Call Harasser who turned out to be a key element of a certain important phone call was not in this case until he pulled that rabbit out of the hat. So jurors are not going to penalize you for that. That keeps them awake. If that 14yearold, now 22 yearold is out there, we invite you onto this program. Would love to hear what you said to Michael Cohen. Is your Refrigerator Running . I would like to know. Rachel maddow, lawrence odonnell, stay with me. We have much more to discuss this evening and our special coverage of Donald Trumps Hush Money Trial right after this break. R this break. So we made meat out of plants. Because we arent quitters. Impossible. Were solving the meat problem with more meat. Did you know some dish soaps dont remove all the grease, even with scrubbing . Whaaat . I just cleaned those try dawn platinum. It removes 99 of grease and food residue. Thats why dawn is trusted to save wildlife affected by oil. 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Day after day, trump surrogates have Season Setting up shop outside the court and talking to the press. Trump is barred from his gag order and barred from directing others to talk about those people. Which is what makes all of this so concerning. When trumps latest batch of surrogates spoke today, they again attacked two individuals the judge has specifically identified as off limits. Michael cohen and the judges own daughter. Im honored to be here with my colleagues from the House Freedom caucus where we watched Michael Cohen get dog walked through the series of lies he has told. Perjurer in chief. Michael cohen. He admitted repeatedly he lied. To collin who admitted to lying. Michael cohen,. Michael cohenning. Seeing the lack of credibility from Michael Cohen. We would be remiss if we did not mention this corrupt judge. This judge whose own family is making six figures off of democrat politics. We have a judge whose daughter. A corrupt judge whose daughter. A judges own daughter. The judges daughter. Thats the judges daughter. All of that clearly breaks the judges gag order if trump indeed directed it. So the question now is, did he . This gag order is to ensure he cannot defend himself fairly. So we are here to have his back. We are here to defend him. We are president trumps voice. We have his back. He will ultimately be proven innocent. Thank you. Join me once again are my colleagues Rachel Maddow and lawrence odonnell. Rachel, the contention here is they are here as members of the public. I know you have been to the courtroom and i hear it is a difficult thing. Can you talk a little bit about what that process was like for you getting seats and how coveted those seats were . It is a big long line and you have to wait forever. It is no easy thing. I think it cost some of those members of Congress Votes today in dc. I mean, i have to say, im a big believer in people showing up to court. And if you know somebody who is on trial, and you believe in their innocence, whether or not you believe in their innocence, you want to support them, being there for them, thats a good thing. There is a reason that our courtrooms are open to the public. Theres a reason our judicial system is a transparent one so everyone can see the proceedings and everyone can show up to support someone if they know is involved in the system. But if you are a public official, a prominent person, the kind of person who will speak to the cameras when you walk out during the morning break, the normal course of events is to say im here to support my friend or colleague or my boss or the guy i want to hire me to be the vice president. Whatever it is. Im here to support x person. I believe in x persons innocence and i believe the jury is going to see that truth, too. And i wish these charges had never been brought. But i believe that this is going to be borne out in the end and everybody will see that my friend, my colleague, my boss is innocent. Like, thats all good. Thats all normal. Instead, what you are getting is these members of congress saying we are here to support him. And the american legal system is illegitimate and corrupt. And the judge is corrupt. Let me tell you about the judges family. That is just a wholly different thing. It is a hard thing to have people in high office committing crimes in this country. It was hard with nixon and agnew and it is hard with trump. There is a reason that sitting president s cant get prosecuted. It is all very difficult. Instead when you is a Political Party saying the american legal system should be gotten rid of because it is corrupt and the people involved in it are corrupt and bad an evil, that is something totally different. That is corrosive to the legal system. Fundamentally destructive here. If that becomes the platform. Yeah. There are so many levels this is appalling. There is the smaller picture of what it is doing to potential witnesses in this trial. There was a whole back and forth about these surrogates being in the trial during Cross Examination. Going out there and impugning. Can you talk a little bit about sort of net effect that this is having as you go to this trial . In the courtroom, no effect at all. You know the old parliamentary phrase back benchers. Thats what they became. Because there were too many of them today. There is a row in the front for donald Trump Supporters. There are usually not more than two or three of them. But there were so many of them, they were literally sent to the back bench of the courtroom that is against the wall furthest away from their hero. Most of them, i didnt know who they were. It is not like they were the most prominent members of congress but they have absolutely no effect on the proceedings. I will say with that shot of them outdoors, thats the largest collection of Trump Supporters who have ever gathered at the publicly available Gathering Place for all Trump Supporters to come. You notice there is no one behind them. Nypd has reserved a spot there for citizens from all over america or New York City or even lower manhattan. Voterrers, Trump Supporters. Anyone can gather there. No one comes. Donald trump wanted them to come. They refused to come. Those people came and that is his biggest crowd ever. Here is an opportunity they had. Because what they do is they come in for the morning session. They leave at the first recess which is like 11 00 a. M. And they never come back. Matt gaetz is the only one who came back. Now they have been in the courtroom. They have been there two hours. You watched the judge. Instead of coming out and talking about his daughter, why dont you talk about his rulings because you just watched him make some rulings. You watched him rule on several objections. And you watched him overrule the prosecutors objections a number of times. Did you agree with that . You watched him sustain some objections. What he said was argumentative and not a question. One of the great tragedies of this trial is that they get to go out there and lie about how this trial is going because none of them have ever in their lives seen and they never will see a more fair judge than judge merchan. And any televised version of this trial would prove that every minute of the trial. Chris hayes referred to him as a picture of equinimity. We have new reporting in the New York Times that i find absolutely staggering. That for days in an around january 17th, 2021, neighbors told the New York Times that Justice Samuel alito, one of the nine justices on the Supreme Court, had an American Flag hanging upside down outside of his house. That inverted flag was being used as a symbol of the stop the steal movement. This is the justice who is very engaged. Continues to be in and around issues concerning trumps role in the january 6th insurrection. Apparently had a stop the steal flag flying outside of his house. He says and in denial, i had no involvement whatsoever of the flying of the flag. It was briefly placed by mrs. Alito in response to a neighbors objectional use of yard signs. This is nothing but a neighborhood snafu. A little battle between neighbors. Rachel, do you have thoughts on that news coming against the backdrop of today . I mean, it is unsettling. It is gross. First of all, everybody has different Marriage Rules. But it is my wifes fault is probably never within the Marriage Rules when you are talking to the New York Times about something you have done that has brought enough scandal. That it is on the front page of the New York Times. It was my wife. Even if it was. I dont know. I dont know. I dont want to give you any advice. But i feel like the upside down flag, it wasnt like he had a trump 2024, trump 2028 flag up there. It was the American Flag upside down which is a traditional symbol of distress. Unless mrs. Alito was signaling her distress, the explanation makes no sense. That was something people were doing around that time to indicate that the country was effectively under siege. Which is something Trump Supporters were makeing the case for. When they described the election as having been stolen. Justice alito has become increasingly unembarrassed about displaying himself as a partisan. As consumer partisan narratives and media and in ruling in ways that is just kind of out loud all caps disdainful. And this fits with that. But it is also something that i have never heard anything like this in the entire history of every controversy. I think chief Justice Roberts has a problem on his hand ins terms of the behavior of some of the more aggressive justices and those really flouting Ethics Concerns and. You know, that flag is not Donald Trumps fault. That flag is george w. Bushs fault. That is who appointed samuel alito to is Supreme Court so anyone who thought in the 2000 election, al gore doesnt excite me, thats what you got. From that decision. Or if you thought george w. Bush is a reasonable man and i want to vote for him because i think he will be more of a connecticut bush than a texas bush, you were wrong. This is what you got. Legacy of the court. On the ballot again this year. Rachel maddow, lawrence odonnell, thank you for joining me again tonight. My dear colleagues, i appreciate your time and energy. We have more special coverage of day 18 of the Trump Criminal Trial which will continue right after the break. Stay with us. The break. Stay with us. As little as 2 weeks. 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I would advise that not happen. Todd blanche, your honor, i have less than zero control over what is happening on anything or anyone that is behind me when im crossing a witness. I dont have any control over that. I mean, they are members of the public. To be clear, these lawmakers are not sitting in public seats. They are sitting in seats for Donald Trumps defense team. Joining me now is adam schiff. Member of the house Judiciary Committee. Thank you for being here. I imagine you have some thoughts about your fellow House Colleagues who have been trekking up to New York City to stand outside of the courtroom and weigh in on this trial. I have so many thoughts. Let me start with the speaker. I have so say i was flabbergasted that he would make that pilgrimage. Stand outside the courthouse and lie about what was going on inside the building. It is bad enough he lacks the selfrespect that he feels he needs to kiss the ring in a public and debasing way. For him to knowingly make the false claim this was designed to keep trump off the campaign trail. It he knows better than that. But it shows the top ranking republican in congress will do everything for donald trump. And for those others, you know, the matt gaetzs, these are crazy people and you dont expect much more. But i will say this, too. The fact some of them are going into the courtroom, this is a way to tamper with the jury. That we believe this is political. We are here to show support for the president. That is making a statement without saying a world. And that is distressing for much the same reason. Congressman, because you singled out the speaker. I do have to ask, you were one of 163 democrats who voted to effectively save speaker johnson from a motion to vacate. Do you have any regrets about that and would do it again . I dont regret it because, two reasons. One, we need a Governing Entity in the house. They have the majority. We need somebody sitting in that speakers chair. I want to get things done for my constituents. We have major challenges with housing, the cost of child care and other things. I want to get things done. You cant do that without a speaker in the chair. Second, i didnt believe it was right to vacate him from the chair. He got around to approving ukraine aid. I dont have any regrets for those reasons but i have to say, it is still difficult to stomach when you see him do what he did, standing in front of that courthouse. And it just shows you that there is no one in that republican conference any more. Not since liz cheney left that has any real commitment to the constitution. Their oath, or system of justice. It is all about keeping power, gaining power. And no debasement too great before their supreme leader. Yeah. It is worth noting that the cynical moves did not end at the New York City courthouse. A lot of those same members had to travel back to washington to vote to hold the attorney general Merrick Garland in contempt for refuseing to hand over the tapes of the conversations that President Biden had with the special Council Robert herr. The one two punch. You are absolutely right. Of standing out there. Tell me more about that endeavor. I was sitting on the Judiciary Committee as they were bringing up this bogus effort to hold the attorney general in contempt. For not having the audio tapes. To hold the attorney general of the United States in contempt to give tapes to his Campaign Team for campaign commercials. But meanwhile, you had republican members missing from the whole debate because they are in new york. Members like matt gaetz who missed the boat completely. They dont think it is important enough to stay in washington to vote on holding the attorney general in contempt if it has to compete with being a spectator in the Hush Money Payment to a porn star. From donald trump. The thing i find so shocking about all of this, i have to imagine that if you asked mike johnson ten or 15 years ago if he would see himself standing in front of the Courthouse Vouching for the character of someone, you could never imagine him doing such a crass thing. And there he is. It is one small surrender of morality followed by another. And pretty soon, you are standing outside the Courthouse Vouching for the character. Someone paying hush money to a porn star. Speaking of surrender of ethics, i want to give your reaction from the New York Times reporting Justice Samuel alito was flying a stop the steal flag on the other hand his house, january 17, of 2021. You know this saga well. Do you have a thought on that given the role the Supreme Court is playing around january 6th . This is why americans have no trust in the Supreme Court anymore. They see justice with a flag. Essentially a stop the steal flag outside their home. Presiding, sitting in cases affecting the investigation into the effort to incite the attack on the capitol. You have Justice Thomas whose wife was in Text Messages and email communications about this effort to overturn the election. Sitting and voting against as a member of the court, voting against providing documents to congress that might implicate his spouse. Not just a perceived conflict. But a real conflict. This is why people have no confidence in the court. And, at the moment, there is no recourse for this. They can violate the Code Of Ethics because there is no enforcement Code Of Ethics for the Supreme Court. But i think as you were discussing earlier with respect to alito, he is proud of his disdain for public opinion. He is proud to wear his partisan sleeve on the flag pole. Thank you for joining me. We really appreciate your time. Thank you. We have more special coverage of trump on trial coming upright after this break. Ng upright after this break. 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As we talked about, you pled guilty to lying to congress, correct . s neck i did. You get the gist. He spent a lot of time on lies but little time challenging Michael Cohen on assertions about Donald Trumps knowledge in the Stormy Daniels hush money scheme. Joining me now are the former District Attorney for the Eastern District of new york and a federal prosecutor and Senior Writer a political magazine. Thank you for joining us. It doesnt matter. The excess of lies. Michael cohen is a lying liar who lies all the time and no one disagrees on that. The prosecution and defense agrees, everyone agrees. Where the defense was effective today in Cross Examination was not only in establishing that, for hours of testimony, that he has lied in the past, they did that effectively, but they showed instances where Michael Cohen lied on this stand to this jury during this trial. I think it resonated differently. Michael cohen testified under direct examination he never wanted to be chief of staff. The defense confronted him with emails and Text Messages that showed he was pining for this job. Does it matter . No, but its a lie he told this jury. He said he never was disputing the underlying facts of his tax case and the defense did a good job of showing excerpts from his book, called revenge, and from his excerpts of trial testimony from the civil fraud trial showing that he was disputing the facts of his tax crimes. He said he pleaded guilty because he was coerced into that plea. They were threatening to indict his wife. Those dont really bear on the ultimate facts, but our little lies he was telling tuesday to this very jury. Of course, this phone call on october the prank phone call. It is explainable, because we all know from common sense when you text someone, you say this person is bothering me, someone says call me, you have a 92nd phone call, its probably about what you were just texting about. Its possible that they had a conversation about Stormy Daniels during the 92nd. I partially blame the prosecution for penning this so specifically on this date and time. They could have just said, did there come a time you had that conversation, it doesnt need to be as specific as the 24th. Of course, the wire payment was two days later and there were two other phone calls two days later between Michael Cohen and donald trump. It can be explained but it was a good moment with that 90 second phone call where Michael Cohen testified that he spoke about it on tuesday, to this very jury, from this specific witness box to these people. That was a problem and they will be able to go to the jury and say that not only is he a liar, but he lied to you. He took an oath and looked at you and he lied to you and you cannot go back and convicted donald trump based on the say so of a liar. That is their defense. The defense has got to be, because weisel burgs handwriting is all over the case. That these were the two together , what is a liar and one is missing. They also painted Michael Cohen as unhinged. Here is what they played for the jury. Actually i hope that this man ends up in prison. It wont bring back the year i lost, or the damage done to my family, but revenge is a dish best served cold. You Better Believe i want this man to go down and rot inside for what he did to me and my family. Well . Yeah, i think it was effective. I agree with everything that duncan said. I think it was effective because , look, i think this was probably the defense is best day in this trial, so far. Its very possible that they succeeded in creating a reasonable doubt in one jurors mind. The thing about playing this commentary is that that is also, if im the defense, another lie that i tie up in closing. This mans choirboy act when he was on the stand earlier this week, acting polite and sincere, that was another fraud, at different Michael Cohen. He was lying to you and presenting himself as someone he is not. The defense will argue about a series of lies. Let me add one last thing. The lie that has been offered so frequently from prosecutors and folks in the media that Michael Cohen has fully corroborated is not true. We learned that because the call with Keith Schiller, in one sense, that testimony is corroborated by call records because we know the call occurred. Its not corroborated in the sense we dont know what happened during the call unless we take Michael Cohens word for it. I think that there are, this is always been the risk in this case, that this day would come when they would do an aggressive crossexamination and could swing the needle. We will find out in a matter of days or weeks if that comes true but this was sort of inevitable. Now we have a couple days to think about all of this. Thank you for joining us. More special coverage of the Hush Money Trial is coming right after the break. Break. 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