well, then what is a trial? >> he said something different as all republicans did when they were on the other side of it. but the democrats are making a lot of same arguments, they just have a better set of facts than republicans had back in '98/'99. >> well, you quoted the founders. and what the founders were most worried about and why they included the impeachment clause and the emoluments clause. we were a young democracy. we were susceptible to foreign interference and i think they were worried about that. that's why they included it. that's why they didn't make a king, they had a president. and i think that the facts in this case are really right at the heart of what they were worried about. >> john podesta, thank you very much for your perspective. appreciate it. >> thanks, chris. >> all right. now, what bill clinton did not have at the time of his impeachment, that was a trial stacked with a majority of jurors from his own party. remember, the republicans were in control of the senate, not the democrats. and he didn't have a fox news to use as a trumpet for his own cause and he didn't have this