Hoping it will keep him out of jail a little longer. Cohen says hes gone through less than 1 of whats on the hard drive and needs more time to review the rest. As of now, cohen heads to jail on may 8th. As you can see, theres a lot to discuss. Former Nixon White House counsel john dean is here, as well as jed sugarman, the author of the peoples courts. Good evening to both of you. Good to see you. Jed, im going to start with you. There are major discrepancies between what barr wrote in that fourpage letter and what Mueller Reportedly said was alarming and significant evidence that trump obstructed justice. Could this infighting signal concerns of a coverup . I think it does signal some concerns, and i think specifically we saw a back and forth where team mueller was calling out team barr because they know so, first of all, we start with the New York Times report from last night where team barr says to the New York Times, we couldnt go with these executive summaries, right . Team mueller wrote summaries. We cant use them because they were intermingled with sensitive information, grand jury information, executive privilege, and then three hours later the Washington Post has team mueller saying, wait a second, we we wrote those reports we wrote those summaries specifically so that they could be used, right . So i looked back at some old the Lawrence Walsh irancontra report, the starr report from the clinton era. They each included simple onepage summaries that we designed for Immediate Release with nothing complicated in them. It is completely implausible that the mueller team would make such a mistake to write these summaries that would have such sensitive information. It exposes barr for being noncredible. John, is something fishy going on here, in your estimation . Barr has certainly fumbled this thing from the outset, don. His socalled summary letter, his conclusions, principal conclusions raised many questions. Its very for such an experienced washington hand, somethings amiss, and it sounds like hes been instructed by the boss to watch out for his best interests, and thats what hes doing. John, if we get past midapril, right, without the full Mueller Report, do you think its going to look like a coverup and, you know, i dont know, barr, will he get the benefit of the doubt until then . John . Im sorry, don. My audio is down. Yeah. If we get to midapril and still dont have the full report, will it start to look like a coverup . And im wondering if people will still continue to give barr the benefit of the doubt. He will lose the benefit of the doubt for he protracted, you know, he withholds information as he is right now. Hes not cooperating. Hes made a promise that hed have it out by the middle of the month. All of his many letters clarifying past letters and past statements are just adding confusion. This has the smell of coverup, and its not a good thing at this point. Was there ever this kind of disconnect between the Justice Department and the special counsels team during watergate . No. No. They were very they were very blunt. Actually, leon jaworski, the last special counsel, Watergate Special prosecutor, went right over and talked to the chief of staff, al hague, and they communicated rather directly about their things. Some of the watergate prosecuting staff was concerned about their relationship, but in the end it turned out jaworski was playing it straight. He didnt want to make any mistakes, and what his intentions were and wanted to understand exactly where the white house was coming from. Jed, i find it interesting that you think that this will head to the Supreme Court. What does this mean for President Trump and why do you think that . Well, i think that we see with barrs behavior that he seems if hes willing to say that the executive summaries, he couldnt include them because theyre protected by executive privilege, he seems willing or his team seems willing to invoke executive privilege for anything and everything. That suggests that the house in order to get just basic access to the report is going to have to litigate. So if you look back to how this transpired with the Oval Office Tapes in the nixon era, it took about five months, four, five months to go from the start of that litigation to the trial all the way up to the Supreme Court. That was a 90 decision with u. S. Versus nixon. 80. The challenge now is can we rely on this Supreme Court to find the right balance with the Public Interest . Executive privilege is not a blanket absolute privilege. It has to be something balanced. So if they get the doctrine right, it should go out to the public. I just think we have to be concerned about this current Supreme Court. Did you say in a previous answer was it you or john, i cant remember, who said about the summaries that it was fishy . Because im just wondering, if the yeah. The doj is saying that these summaries contain privileged material, and there is no way mueller would make that mistake. Did you say that . Yeah, i think i said that. I didnt say that. Go ahead. Go ahead, jed. Its a good point, though. Right. It seems ridiculous to think that team mueller with all of its experienced lawyers who surely would have looked back at past special counsels. They would be foolish to have written executive summaries that would then be subject to and vulnerable to this argument. In fact, they told the Washington Post explicitly, if you look back at the report, they said we wrote these summaries so they could be immediately released and not redacted. So theyre calling barr out. They know that barr has made a mistake, and give it its remarkable that for two years there were no leaks from team mueller until now. They basically gave barr a chance, and they waited and now theyre saying we want the public to know that barr is not playing straight. John, why do you want muellers investigator mueller, his lawyers or investigators to speak out . And why are you calling them wussies . Because i think they should stand up. Many of them are no longer in the government. Some in the government might go to the attorney general himself if theyre working for him and protest, but i think those out of government ought to call the press right in and say, listen, im not going to disclose any grand jury information, but i can tell you whats going on is not right and this attorney general better get it right or im going to speak out more, and i think theyre wusses if they dont do so. I got to get you to weigh in on this news about Michael Cohen tonight. Do you think congress will buy that he has 14 million files that just popped up the month before hes supposed to report . I have been looking for when they he learned about the files. One report has recent, and its another report i saw implied that he when he got the material back that had been taken from him in the raid, but it doesnt make it clear when they got that material back, thats when he started going through them. But this sounds like its material that the governments already had in the Southern District. So they may have already been through it. Obviously michael can find things in his own files that would have different meaning than the Southern District looking at those files in the raw, so i think its important that he be given an opportunity, and 30 days is not much time to go through 14 million files. If indeed this is legitimate, as it sounds, i cant imagine lanny not playing it straight with the court or with the members of congress, i think he ought to be given some time to do it. Jed, do you think that congress will be able to persuade the Southern District to postpone as cohen and his team wants . Big picture, i think Michael Cohen is overrated in all of these stories. I think underrated is whatever else the Southern District is working on, and big time overrated is what the new York Attorney general is working on, such as potential Money Laundering through deutsche bank. We should keep our eye on that and less on Michael Cohen. Even with all the information thats come to light, the Stormy Daniels hush money payments, the checks, the information and financial documents hes provided, you think hes overrated when it comes to this . No, i think this new news is overrated. I think the Southern District probably already has all of that and sufficient information to go with that. Jed sugarman, john dean, thank you, sirs, appreciate it. Even maralago is know scape from uncomfortable questions for this president. Were going to dig into the latest on the Security Breach at the president s private club next. When we started our business we were paying an arm and a leg for postage. I remember setting up shipstation. One or two clicks and everything was up and running. I was printing out labels and saving money. Shipstation saves us so much time. It makes it really easy and seamless. Pick an order, print everything you need, slap the label onto the box, and its ready to go. Our costs for shipping were cut in half. Just like that. Shipstation. The 1 choice of online sellers. Go to shipstation. Com tv and get 2 months free. The Chinese Government is now providing Consular Services to the woman arrested for illegally entering President Trumps maralago club. She has suspicious items including four cell phones and a thumb drive with Malicious Software on it. So, could she be a foreign spy . The fbi is now investigating. Lets discuss now. Matthew rosenberg and phil mudd are here. Gentlemen, good evening to you. Matthew, you say if you were a foreign spy, you would have a maralago membership. Is there anything stopping someone with that same idea . I mean, if you run a Foreign Spy Service and either dont have a member there or arent trying to become a member, you arent doing your job. I think that includes our allies as well. You know, every weekend the president goes down there. He talks to club members about policy, business. You also get a sense of what his life is like, what his interests are. People around to talk to. All these atmospherics. Of course you want to be in there. Thats the most powerful man in the world. Why wouldnt you want to be in there . The fact that somebody is coming in there with three, four cell phones and a ton of malware. Four cell phones. That should send a lot of red flags. Phil, i want to hear what you think of this. This woman with her four cell phones, laptop computer, external hard drivetype device and a thumb drive with malicious malware on it. Game out some of the things that could happen. Number one, whether these going to introduce something to the software there that allows that malware to sort of penetrate the system of maralago. The bigger question i would have is whether there is something that enables you to place a listening device. Its a rare day, don, i have to agree with a journalist, with matt, this gives me tremendous pain. I look at this and say if youre conducting espionage, and you can spend 200,000 bucks to get somebody in there are find somebody sympathetic to china, why the heck would you send a woman who cant figure out what her cover story is and looks like she ripped off the Electronics Section at target . There is Something Weird here but this cant be a classic espionage operation. At a hearing today, zhang said she works at a shanghai private equity firm but paid per project, hasnt made any money in 2019. She also said she owns a 1. 3 million house in china, drives a bmw. Does that raise any questions about someone who hasnt worked this year and has, you know, that kind of capital and conflicting stories about what she was doing, matthew . Look, beyond the Foreign Spy Services, private equity firm, theyre probably thinking, you know, maybe shes some kind of piecemeal contractor. She goes in there and finds out some good tip, change in u. S. Policy, china trade issue, you cash in on that. Its a place that is wide open and all issues being discussed there. If youre a real spy, maybe they do it on purpose. Like right in front of your face, you know what im saying . I dont know, phil. I suspect that there probably are all kinds of grifters and hangers on trying to get in there. You are thinking there must be some sort of pot of gold. Great information. Phil, go ahead. I think there is a secondary question that youre touching on here, don, and that is we keep talking about a spy as someone has to be sent in by the chinese state. I look and say there are secondary questions youre talking about, for example, industrial easy podspionage. What are her business interests . There is something behind this, i just dont think its the Chinese Intelligence Services per se. I dont think so. She also said she had a Wells Fargo Bank account because she was looking for a Business Partner in the United States but nothing had panned out. Does that raise any red flags to you . Not really. I mean, i looked at all the data behind her, including the wells fargo case that youre talking about, and theres a lot of information that suggests that she did have some planning behind this. So that piece of data tells me that she didnt just stroll into the United States and say, i want to walk up to maralago, but, man, the Unanswered Questions here are bigger than the answered one. I cant quite figure out what shes up to. And by the way, what she thought she was going to do once she got in there. She couldnt figure out whether she was going to the pool or to a u. N. Event. Thats her story . Something wrong here. Come on, don, shes an embarrassment for spies globally. We dont know if shes a spy or someone who has got some issues, right . Yeah. But, i mean the president said hes not worried about it. Thats the bigger issue here. Look, we know the president has a loose relationship with his own security. We know about his cell phones. Those cell phone calls he talks to his friends on totally insecure. We know hes bragged about classified information with the Russian Foreign minister and ambassador in the oval office. Thats something that voters have to decide. The president can do all of this. He has the right to classify and declassify anything he wants. If voters are okay with this, they can vote that way, but its something worth debating a little bit. Thank you, guys. Spies everywhere. Thank you. Thank you. Appreciate it. The president has another recommendation for the fed board. This one a friend. You wont guess who it is, but can i give you a hint . 9, 9, 9. danny let me get this straight. After a long day of hard work. You have to do more work . vo automatically sort your expenses and save over 40 hours a month. danny every day youre nearly fried to a crisp, professionally vo you earned it, were here to make sure you get it. Quickbooks. Backing you. Mno kidding. Rd. But moving your internet and tv . Thats easy. Easy . easy . Easy. Because now xfinity lets you transfer your Service Online in just about a minute with a few simple steps. Really . Really. That was easy. Yup. Plus, with twohour appointment windows, its all on your schedule. Awesome. Now all you have to do is move. That thing. [ sigh ] introducing an easier way to move with xfinity. Its just another way were working to make your life simple, easy, awesome. Go to xfinity. Com moving to get started. President trump says that he is recommending herman cain, a former pizza executive and a 2012 republican president ial contender, for a seat on the Federal Reserve board. Cain dropped his bid amid Sexual Harassment allegations, allegations he denied. Good evening to both of you. So, katherine, the Federal Reserve is the most powerful central bank in the world. Herman cain, do you think hes a good choice . No. No, absolutely not. Look, maybe the Federal Reserve, the most powerful central bank in the world, thats a very apt description, can withstand one very disruptive factual challenged appointment to that board, ie steven moore, who was announced a couple of weeks ago. I dont think they can withstand two. Both of these candidates, neither of which has had their nomination submitted to the senate at this point. Right. Both of them would politicize what absolutely needs to be the other candidate being Steven Steven moore. And herman cain. Both historically inflation hawks. People who advise the central back to raise Interest Rates because theyre very worried about inflation. Have suddenly changed their tune now that a republican is in office, and instead they are saying that we should fear nonexistent deflation and we should pump more money into the economy just as, of course, that republican in the white house is up for reelection. Is he a good choice, scott . Hes going to need a very thorough vetting. You know, obviously you have a background check process before your nomination gets submitted and then hes going to need a very thorough vetting by the committee. Let me ask, do you think he would be confirmed . Well, i think when you go before a Committee Like this, youre going to get a lot of questions about your views on monetary policy, and current, you know, events and how you want to handle the economy. Were going to have to see how he stands up to that. So if i were a republican senator looking at an unconventional nomination for a technical board like this, i would come ready with a lot of technical questions, and i would withhold my judgement until i could see whether that person could handle those sorts of questions. I would say its sufficient to say that herman cain supports the gold standard, which Economic Experts have round rejected as a good form of monetary policy. You remember the 999. I do. He wanted to be catchy. It was. He caught some fire. And then i have to ask you about this, scott, because this was all part of it. In november of 2011 after the initial accusations, accusations of Sexual Harassment against cain, trump told fox news, greta van susteren, that the win were seeking fame, even though they were both anonymous at the time. He said the same about his accusers. I wonder why he would nominate someone with similar baggage because then it would be brought back up. Do you see that . I definitely see it. All these questions are going to get asked at a confirmation hearing, and obviously theyre also going to be investigated as part of a background check. So i think were probably pretty far away from these nominations being submitted. Once they are submitted, you know, typically these things dont get a ton of news because people come and answer questions and they get confirmed, but this one is going to get a lot of attention. Its not going to be a quick process. I wouldnt imagine. And i think i think the president s going to run into more resistance on this than perhaps he would want out of Something Like this appointment. Catherine, can you talk to us about the fed . Isnt it youre supposed to place people on it who have experience, not political cronies, its supposed to be nonpartisan. Its a very big deal. Yes, it is absolutely critical for the fed to function for it to be politically independent, both in actuality and in perception. And the reason why is evident from lots of counterexamples that weve seen like venezuela and argentina and preeuro italy and lots of other places where the Printing Press was in the hands of politicians. Politicians, again, always have an incentive to print a little bit more money, especially in an Election Year or heading into an Election Year, so that they can get growth a little bit stronger and make them look a little bit better. But the long run tradeoff of that is you can have inflation. So you want a central bank that people credibly believe is willing to do unpopular things, as done in the 80s, and if they dont believe that the fed is independent, if instead they think that the central bank is doing the bidding of whoevers in the white house or whoevers in congress or whatever, then it can be kind of it can be kind of a selffulfilling prophesy. So the two things that the fed is responsible for is price stability and maximum employment. Its very difficult for them to maintain price stability if people just believe theyre there to be lackeys to the president. I want to make a turn and talk to you guys about the New York Times reporting as far back as february the president asked Senate Majority leader Mitch Mcconnell to prioritize a confirmation vote for his nominee to be the chief counsel of the irs. Im just wondering, first an answer from you, catherine, was he trying to fast track an ally in anticipation for democratic demands for his taxes . It certainly looks like that. Not just an ally but someone who provided the Trump Organization briefly at one point tax advice. Bloomberg broke this last year, in fact. Look, trump is clearly very afraid that whatevers in his tax returns will come out and will become public. Thats why he has broken with more than four decades of precedent. Fo for president s to not only divest from what might present a conflict of interest, but to be transparent about whats in their tax returns. Jimmy carter had to give up his peanut farm, for gods sake. Trump has this sprawling multinational empire. We dont know who has been paying him money, who he owes money to and how easily they could call those loans. We dont know if hes making money off the presidency or breaking tax laws or committing other financial crimes. There is ample evidence to suggest we should at least be asking questions about this. He wants to safeguard whatever financial documents he can to help answer those questions. Scott, i want you to weigh in. The times also reports it was a bigger priority than attorney general barr. Talk to me about the does the timing seem suspicious to you . Well, look, i cant speak to why he wanted it fast tracked. People can speculate. I think regarding the tax return issue generally, he needs to be prepared for these things to become public. I think the democrats are not going to give up on this, and they obviously have some lines of inquiry here that could bear fruit. I heard Lindsey Graham today say that if he were running for president in 2020, he thinks all the candidates should disclose their tax returns. I presume that would include bernie sanders, still not giving his up. My view is it would probably be in the president s best interest to prepare for these things to come out one way or the other, and if you are going to have to produce them, if your lawyers ultimately decide that is going to happen, to do it on terms that you can get out there and explain yourself. Im sure hes got a complicated tax return and there will be things in there that people are going to want to have to been you know, pick apart. I would say this, you know, at one point in our most recent history when weve had discussions about using the irs for political purposes, it was a republican president trying to get the irs to use their powers to harm his political enemies. The irs commissioner at that time resisted that. So did the treasury secretary. In this case we have democrats trying to, i think, use the irs as a political cudgel against a republican president. Im not saying there couldnt possibly be legitimate reasons to see these tax returns, but i think we have to be very careful that the two parties dont start using the irs, no matter who is in power, to go after their political enemies. Look, i think that the American People absolutely have a right to know whether their president , whether the most important and most public figure in the world is running the executive branch for americans benefit or for his own. And we could answer these questions easily if trump abided by these nearly half century norms that have been in place, and he voluntarily released those documents himself. No one would need to be, quote, unquote, using the irs as a political cudgel if, in fact, trump just volunteered the information that has been widely expected of president s with much less conflicted portfolios within their private ownership. Im out of time. Thank you both. I appreciate it. Boeing, the manufacturer of the Ethiopian Airlines flight that crashed last month. Apologizing after confirming that the doomed crew followed all instructions. What we are learning about what went wrong and questions about the 737 maxs safety. Tonight, cnn obtained a preliminary report on the last moments of the Ethiopian Airlines which crashed last month, uh killing all on board. The crew battled with the planes control system just takeoff. Cnns tom foreman. Reporter the trouble starts right after take off. On the left side dont match the reading on the right side. The two sensors on the front disagreeing about the angle of the aircrafts nose. The sensor on the right show es steady readings around 15 degrees, but the one on the left swings wildly from 11 to nearly 75 degrees steep, as if the plane is rocketing upward. Those readings are false, but they appear to trigger the mcas system, an onboard Computer System which starts pulling the nose down. If the plane were climbing steeply, that would prevent a stall, but because it is climbing normally, the system erroneously starts pushing it toward the ground. The report does not name mcas but boeing has now acknowledged it was involved. The captain asked the first officer to pitch up together, to pull back on their controls simultaneously. It does not work. Instead, the flight data recorder shows the plane diving, in all four times without pilots input. An impact warning sounds in the cockpit, dont sink, dont sink. The crew performed all the procedures repeatedly provided by the manufacturer, but was not able to control the aircraft. Reporter the report says the cockpit crew even figures out what is wrong and disables the mcas system, then the captain asked his first officer about a key part of the plane needed to regain control, the trim. The reply, it is not working. Less than six minutes in, once again, the aircraft began pitching nose down, eventually reaching 40 degrees. And it slams into the ground with 157 people on board at nearly 600 miles an hour. It is all eerily similar to the crash of an identical jet near indonesia last fall, killing 189 people, and even though this is just a preliminary report, which does not find a probable cause, boeing is promising a Software Update for mcas, additional Safety Measures and trying to regain public confidence. This update along with the associated training and additional educational materials that pilots want in the wake of these accidents will eliminate the possibility of unintended mcas activation and prevent an mcasrelated accident from ever happening again. Reporter still, only a couple of years ago boeing was talking about how much it appreciated the governments new streamlined approach to regulation, particularly in regard to the max line of planes. And now investigations are swirling around all of these planes, about their development, their testing, their certification and whether people can ever truly trust them again. Don . Tom foreman, thank you so much. I want to bring in cnns richard quest, the host of quest means business. Its just the worst nightmare. Listen, before we talk about what happened, the failure of this system has left families devastated. The company is reeling. Investigators say there is an Additional Software problem in this 737 max Flight Control system. What do you know about that . Boeing said there is this Additional Software issue they are looking at. They describe it as a minor issue, and i suppose its to be expected in a way, that any glitch, any part would have been found now and would have to be dealt with as theyre putting the whole thing back together again. We dont know the full severity of it, but boeing has admitted that, yes, it does exist. Can you imagine the plane pitching up and down. As i said, its the worst nightmare. In the cabin when this was happening, explain to us. Tonight i was flying back from oslo, and i was reading the report in its in its fullness and i was trying to imagine what it would be like. Youre flying along and you take off and just wobbling a bit. Nothing much. Suddenly the nose goes down. Suddenly the pilots manage to pull the nose back up again, so youre going back up. Its all happening very fast. Plane is accelerating to very high speeds, then for the next once, and then again, and again, again, mcas pushes the nose down to the point youre 40 degrees going down. I sat on this plane tonight and tried to imagine, and luckily i was unable to imagine what it must have been like because the w horror of it is extreme. Six minutes of that. The ceo, boeings ceo in a statement, he acknowledges the immense gravity and devastation of the families and the Current Situation its caused. What does boeing need to do to restore confidence, richard . Very simple, repair it. Repair it. Repair it to such an extent that everybody, including the ceo of Ethiopian Airlines, who i interviewed today, and he said i will be the last one to put my planes back in the air because i am going to want the ultimate proof from boeing that it is safe. Now, the statement tonight went a long way to doing the mea culpa. He actually said we own it, talking about the unintended consequences of mcas. Don, you have to ask the question whether or not mcas was fit for purpose. Because you have two crashes in very small order, and the sort of reasons that could have prevented it, redundancy in the systems, manual override, ability to pull back with enough force, that going in should have all been in there before. Would you feel comfortable flying on these planes, richard . You fly all the time. I mean, thats a very, very heads you win, tails i lose question. In that sense. You know, the number of flights that have been without incident versus the two terrible ones with horrible consequences. I keep coming back to this point of boeing. Boeing is devastated. The men and women at boeing who make these planes know that we get on them and fly, and if you think about tonight, of the tens of thousands of boeing planes in the sky that will make their journeys perfectly safely. So i think we dont necessarily need to cut boeing slack, but i think we need to recognize that they too are as engaged now. Now, my caveat to this, of course, don, is when the final investigation comes through, and the final report, and the faa has looked into its own soul and worked out where it also went wrong, there needs to be a complete rethink at the certification of aircraft. You can never have this again. Richard quest, much appreciated. Thank you, sir. Well be right back. Audible members know listening has the power to change us make us better parents, better leaders, better people. And theres no better place to listen than audible. With audible you get a credit good for any audiobook and exclusive fitness and wellness programs. And now, youll also get two Audible Originals titles exclusively produced for audible. Automatically roll your credits over to the next month if you dont use them, and if you dont like a book just swap it for free. Enjoy 100 ad free listening in the car, on your phone or any connected device. And when you switch a device pick up right where you left off. With our commitment free guarantee, theres never been a better time to start listening to audible. The most inspiring minds, the most compelling stories, the best place to listen. To start your free 30day trial, text listen9 to 500500 today. Pete buttigieg has surprised some people with his momentum in a really crowded field of democratic president ial hopeful. The mayor of south bend who is a gay his countercultural approach to christianity is what America Needs now. Kirsten is here to discuss. Good evening. Thank you so much. Fascinating piece, by the way. Thank you. So why does mayor buttigiegs countercultural approach to christianity what we need now . Because i think we have, you know, for quite some time had a dominance of the religious right where its gotten to the point where i think a lot of americans think that to be a christian is to be a member of the religious right, to hold the kind of theology that they have, to vote the way that they vote. In fact, there is a long history of progressive christianity and that has really gotten lost, and that we, you know, most people know that, of course, you know, we had the civil rights movement, and Martin Luther king jr. And it was driven by their faith, but i think in the modern modern society we have sort of ceded that to the right and liberals have said, you know, were not the religious people. We believe in separation of church and state, which, of course, everyone should believe in, but theres no reason to creed cede that ground in terms of christianity to the religious right who are often misrepresenting, frankly, what jesus taught. You write about mayor buttigieg, saying so much about what chris said so little litmus test for the christian faith. When it, in fact, jesus never mentioned the issue. That omission has not stopped many rightwing christians from using president Donald Trumps antiabortion rights judicial appointments as the president s get out of jail free card and license for them to support a leader who consistently behaves in a way thats antithetical to the teachings of jesus. Okay, so, do you think someone like buttigieg could appeal to the evangelical voters or is he just, you know, not in line with what they believe . Well, i think that or how they believe. Yeah, he would have a hard time appealing to them, i think, because he is obviously doesnt believe homosexuality is a sin, which is very core to their theology, also very core to their beliefs is, you know, being very antiabortion rights and hes not. Hes proabortion rights, and so i think that he probably would be speaking to more, you know, independentminded people, people who, you know, there are a lot of religious people on the left. I mean, africanamericans are very religious and they vote overwhelmingly democratic. There are a lot of democrats who are faithful christians. You also asked him if he believed President Trump was a christian. How did he respond . He said looking its very difficult to look at his actions and say that they are the actions of a person who believes in god. I saw a lot of conservatives complaining, saying he was saying that trump, you know, wasnt a christian or didnt believe in god, but he actually was just saying, like, we can look at how this person behaves and say this isnt really consistent with the teachings of jesus. I think thats a completely fair think to say. I dont honestly know how anybody can disagree with it. Its a fascinating article. Why dont we bring in bakari sellers. Bakari, listen, like so many other democrats vying for the white house, mayor buttigieg is making a big push to appeal to africanamericans, to the africanamerican voters. During a speech today before al sharptons National Action network, he clarified, this was a comment he made in 2015, about all lives matter. Listen to this. What i did not understand at that time was that that phrase just early into mid eventually 2015 was coming to be viewed as a counterslogan to blaerck live matter. This statement that seems very an dine and nobody could be against was actually being used to devalue what the black lives Matter Movement was telling us. Since learning why that phrase was being used to push back on activism, ive stopped using it in that context. Does that explanation work you for . It does. Hes done a good job at least verbalizing he has an africanamerican agenda. Talking about and atoning for some of those mistakes. This race is a marathon over time. Youre going to see candidates apologize for things that they may have said that were, i mean, like i told mayor pete, that was a very, very stupid statement and its good to address that head on, and which he did. But to harp on something that kirsten said earlier from her very, very outstanding oped piece in usa today, one of his advantages is that hes going to go into these areas and be able to talk about his faith, especially when youre talking about the black community and africanamerican vote in places like south carolina. Its going to resonate. I wonder if this if the issue of black lives matter. Listen, criminal justice reform, prison reform, those are going to be big issues. Remember, black lives matter, that played huge in 2016. We had countless conversations about it, all three of us, right, on this very network, on this very show. Im wondering if this could hurt him with africanamerican voters. Correct me if im wrong, bakari, may have hurt hillary clinton. Do you think its going to hurt him . I dont think so. I think africanamericans currently trust me, one of the things i always tell people is i dont speak for all black people. Me, don lemon, angela rye, simone sanders, we dont speak for all black people. Voters are paying close attention, theyre holding their candidates accountable and they want to see policy points that are going to uplift black folk. Kirsten, on friday even more Democratic Candidates are slated to address the National Action network. Elizabeth warren, kamala harris, cory booker obviously im not an expert on this, but i do think a lot of the way to reach africanamerican voters is, frankly, the way you reach any voter. You know, theyre interested about the same things that everyone else is interested in. We talk about the White Working Class all the time. Well, guess what . There is a black working class. Amen. You need to go into black communities the same way you go into, you know, pennsylvania to talk to White Working Class people. You need to go and talk to black working class people. You need to talk to people who are, you know, upper middle class. You need to talk to people who are really struggling and even are poor. Great conversation. Again, a great article by kirsten in usa today. Mayor Pete Buttigiegs counterculture to American Christian is what we need now. I encourage you to read it. Thank you both. Our coverage continues. Audible members know listening has the power to change us make us better parents, better leaders, better people. And theres no better place to listen than audible. With audible you get a credit good for any audiobook and exclusive fitness and wellness programs. And now, youll also get two Audible Originals titles exclusively produced for audible. Automatically roll your credits over to the next month if you dont use them, and if you dont like a book just swap it for free. Enjoy 100 ad free listening in the car, on your phone or any connected device. And when you switch a device pick up right where you left off. 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