kaepernick's kneeling really was this kind of seismic social and political event, right, it has all sorts of cascade effects. all of a sudden now this thing that's been in everyone's household across the country, comes the awkward chatter, the national anthem, the sports casters, and donald trump, and we've seen several rounds now, i think of racial justice protest and backlash, racial justice protests and backlashes. we're going through one of the backlashes now with this attack on critical race theory. as someone, i think so much of your work is about basically critically encountering race through the work you do, i'm curious what you make of the backlash? >> oh, gosh, i think it's ridiculous. it's pedestrian. i think it's also pretty expected. it's in the continuum of the idea that progress can be stopped, right. it may be slowed down, but it can never be thwarted, and i saw