Rare occurrence. Volatile stock market. When markets are already jittery about the economic circumstances, the last thing they need to see is shakiness from washington. To whatever it was that Steve Mnuchin was doing in his phone calls to banks. Its very normal for the treasury secretary to constitutional people up and say, hey, hows christmas looking . When all in starts right now. Good evening from new york, im chris hayes. Every day the president sounds more and more like a mob boss. Thats not right. The president has been working in the white house where he has been stewing over what has been happening to him. Theres a lot of bad news up and down the roster for the president as this year ends. He is right now on an air base in germany where he has touched down refueling after his very first stop in a war zone, visiting troops in iraq. He was there during a secret mission that was revealed today, greeting the troops in iraq. He stayed for three hours, and did not visit the Prime Minister of iraq before leaving. That trip came at the tail end of what had been a tough four days for the president who was clearly in a cranky mood tweeting at one point, i am all alone, poor me, in the white house. And waiting for the democrats to come back and make a deal on desperately needed border security. There are certainly plenty of issues to keep poor trump in a bad mood. The Government Shutdown is now in its fifth day, there is no border wall, and mexico wont be paying for it. His secretary of defense jim mattis resigned. Brett mcgirk quit after the president s abrupt decision to pull out of syria. Stock markets have whipsawed back and forth as investors try to figure out what exactly is going on with the president insulting the head of the Federal Reserve and treasury secretary Steven Mnuchin calling banks to reassure everyone everythings fine, no problems at all. That instead spooked investors. And, of course, theres the ongoing Mueller Investigation with its growing list of indictments and flipped trump cronies. The president is a little cranky, and its unlikely to get better in the new year. Democrats take power in the house of representatives in just eight days, and nancy pelosi, the almost certain exspeaker of the house is making it pretty clear shes not going to give the president his wall. Telling usa today first of all the fact that he says were going to build a wall with cement and mexicos going to pay for it, hes already backed off the cement now hes down to, i think, a beaded curtain or something, im not sure where he is. Heres a democratic policy and communications committee. Whats the game plan here, congressman . As incoming speak epelosi said when democrats take back the house on january 3rd we will move swiftly to reopen the government. I think there was a deal already, 100 senators, 100 to zero voted for a continuing resolution. That wouldnt pass the house. The president changed his mind, i think, in part because of all the things you just described in an effort to distract from a very bad couple of weeks, the president shut the government down. Democrats will make sure it reopens on january 3rd. Just to be clear, thats on the first day passed basically the piece of legislation thats already passed by the senate, by unanimous voice vote and dare mcconnell to not bring it up . Correct. Theyve already voted for it. So i think theyre going to be in a tough position. Its a new congress. Thats right. Theyve already voted for it. Theyre in a tough position to suddenly not vote for it. The government will have been closed for several weeks by that point, two weeks. And the reality is there are more than 400,000 employees working and not getting paid. We need to reopen the government. Were going to have lots of disagreement about policies but we need to open the government, and were going to vote to open it and the senate will do the same, i expect and its up to the president. We should note, of course, that some of those people who are not working are subcontractors, people who do security, janitorial services, who probably wont be paid. Theyre out of luck. Well, i mean, i think we have to make sure that we do everything to insist that everyone gets paid. I mean, its outrageous that anybody would be expected to work and not get paid, especially during the holidays. Theres an interesting story about elijah cummings, the incoming chair of the Oversight Committee, sending 51 letters to the white house requesting compliance with document requests. These are as far as i can understand these are a variety of areas, things on the trump organization, foreign governments, hurricane maria, family separation, border stuff and theyre all already outstanding document requests that had existed, this is reiterating that with the power of an incoming majority. What will happen on that front . Well, i think its important to remember democrats ran on an agenda articulating that were fighting for the people of this country, not for the special interests, not for the powerful lobbyists. And we committed to driving down health care costs, particularly the cost of prescription drugs, raising family incomes by rebuilding the infrastructure of our country and taking on the pervasive cooperation in washington. At the same time people expect us to do oversight. In the Judiciary Committee we have over 500 pages that really summarize our efforts in the last two years to do oversight that were blocked by the republicans. I know its the same in the Oversight Committee. We are going to do our job, were going to hold this Administration Accountable. Elijah cummings wants to make sure a bunch of documents are preserved so we can do the oversight the constitution requires us to do. Youre going to be taking over a branch of congress, youre going to be sending into the majority with a Government Shutdown and a media fight. I wonder how you, your colleagues are sort of thinking about gaming out the strategy of this house majority, which is walking into day one into essentially a kind of staring contest with the president. Well, i think the way were walking into it, and leader pelosi has said this, we will promptly open the government. We understand the first responsibility we have is to open the government, to force the president to sign legislation or let it go forward without his signature that opens the government again. So that we can continue to move forward on the agenda that we really articulated during this campaign, the issues that matter to the American People and at the same time do our oversight responsibilities, which our republican colleagues have neglected almost entirely in the last two years. You know, this is part of our work, the American People gave us the house because they want us to move forward on the issues that matter in their lives and they want to be certain were doing our job and holding this Administration Accountable and we intend to do that. Congressman, thanks for being here. I want to bring in barbara boxer, democratic senator from the state of california, and ben rhodes. The president is making his first stop ever to u. S. Troops in a combat zone for christmas, right now in a refueling stop in germany, this coming after that remarkable letter from mattis and then the president over that Holiday Weekend abruptly firing the man, essentially, and terminating him early. What do you think the consequences of that action are . Well, you know, i think what its done, chris, is its given every other country around the world complete whiplash. What we had is for a period of weeks a Foreign Policy articulated by the National Security adviser and secretary of state about us staying in syria, and staying indefinitely and expanding the commission to counter iran. And the president pulls the rug out from under his own policy. If youre an ally, you have no idea which way the United States is going. If you are people who fought with us on the ground in syria, t like the kurdish fighters who have done most of the ground work against isis youve been hung out to dry and you are threatened by turkish troops coming into your territory. Even if you support, as i do, some phase drawdown of u. S. Forces in syria the way this president went about doing it, breeds chaos. Nobody knows who to call to find out the position of the United States. We have an outgoing defense secretary and we have an outgoing envoy who ran the counterisis coalition that trump said he never even met. It creates an environment of chaos around american Foreign Policy. Senator boxer, youve been through a number of legislative battles and staredowns over things like budgets and the like. Yes. I wonder how much you think how the incentives to cooperate or not cooperate operate in this kind of government. In terms of the shutdown, ill tell you what i think has to happen. We have to see some of the president s constituencies call him and tell him what it really is like when the government shuts down and their small business, whether its a restaurant or a local store or a hotel near Yosemite Park suddenly stops generating business. I remember one Government Shutdown, the pain was so great, not only on these workers, many of whom earn 30,000, 40,000, they live paycheck to paycheck. And they have decided they want to work for america. Thats what they do. In all kinds of capacities, whether its the justice department, whether its tsa. And they keep us safe. And theyre not getting paid. And thats one part of the problem. But again, the private sector that donald trump prides himself on, they have to call him up right now if theyre listening to me and tell him dont do this. Dont do what you did with tariffs. Theyre hurting business as well. And get this done. But Nancy Pelosis going to come in with the democrats, shes going to vote to open up the government, the senate is going to get that bill. If they dont take it up, if mitch doesnt take it up, Mitch Mcconnell, theres going to be hell to pay in the country. And they cant afford to sit on it. I mean, that is a i think an astute observation of the dynamics. But mcconnell, then, we watched him do this with merit garland and he was happy to have the hell to pay on his shoulders. Mcconnell has no constituency he answers to other than the republican donor class and the president essentially. Does pressure work anymore on the operators in this sort of game . I think it does. I think with the democrats coming in after this amazing blue wave tsunami, whatever you call it, you know, doing the right thing, doing the grown up thing, all eyes are going to be on the senate. Yeah. And Mitch Mcconnells running again and there are already lots of funds that are called ditch mitch. He is an astute politician and hes got to get this done. Weve got to open up the government and do Everything Else that we have to do. What do you think of that, ben . Well, i have to say that Mitch Mcconnell is not someone whos ever seemed to be particularly disturbed by hypocrisy. The man literally could go out one day and say he will never do something and the next day he will do the opposite if thats what he believes, again, his political constituencies demand. As you said, that really is a slice of donors and President Trump. I hope senator boxer is right. We miss senator boxer in the senate. My concern is, again, theres a kind of anihilism to what trump is doing. He feels cornered, chris. Hes not going to pass legislation with a democratic house. And my concern is that hes burning down the house with him as we go, ratcheting up trade wars, ratcheting up the dysfunction in our Foreign Policy, playing politics with the Government Shutdown and paychecks of hundreds of thousands of americans. Thats what should worry us. The one thing that could possibly get through to him is the looming economic downturn, the tanking stock market, the negative economic indicators, all these actions have a real consequence and theyre going to make his difficult reelection that much harder. Senator boxer, you can see hes spooked by that, reporting suggests that hes saying it in public, berating the fed chair and maybe threatening to fire him, which is not something that happens that often. Do you think fundamentally theres danger as we go into this next year with the president in the kind of mind state hes in and with the objective conditions in the world and the economy changing to rapidly . Sure theres danger, and ill tell you, if youre kurdish, youre already in a lot of trouble. They did the fighting for us. If youre an american that has a 401 k , this man, you dont know what hes going to tweet, what hes going to do. Janet yellen was a great fed chair and always kept Interest Rates low for a reason, she was concerned about jobs and the economy. He takes her off there because he says she doesnt look the part. Shes too short. I get very upset, under 50 here. Shes short. He puts this guy in, i dont know him, and then he rips the guy to shreds, unheard of. It is unethical. It has never been done. And ill tell you, wall street, where i worked a thousand years ago, wall street, the thing they hate the most is this kind of chaos, this up and down and down and up. And, you know, hey, a thousand points up, thats great, is it going to go down a thousand points tomorrow . This is not good for the country. So i think the last point id make about donald trump is he does look at his approval ratings. They are not good. And when nancy pelosi gets in there and the democrats act like grown ups, and ill tell you, mitch is going to be in a tough spot. Let them pass it, let them send the reopening of the government. It could be short term, to the president and let them override his veto. If hes still listening to president rush limbaugh. Oh, i mean, radio talk show rush limbaugh. 2019 starting with a president ial override of the government starting. Thank you for your time. Nick akerman, former assistant special watergate prosecutor and msnbc legal analyst. I wanted to talk to you because i deleted twitter off my phone for the holidays. But to the extent i was reading back in today the president s sort of alone stewing in this kind of empty white house. When you read the inside accounts as nixons presidency is going down the tubes and the sort of alienation, increasing isolation, he also was drinking a lot, which this president doesnt do, theres a resonance. Very much the same. Nixon really kept to himself. He wound up sitting in front of the fire and kind of ruminating. To the point where his secretary of defense was so concerned that there was an alert to go out to not take any of nixons orders if he were to ask them to basically release any of the icbms, the missiles against russia. This actually happened. Right, this really happened. People were really concerned. He has got the entire wall falling in on him at this point. Hes got three cooperating witnesses, three people who are very close to him, michael flynn, his former security adviser, gates who was the deputy to manafort and was running the campaign after manafort left, and then youve also got Michael Cohen, his personal lawyer. I mean, i dont think we ever had any witnesses in watergate that were that close to nixon. I mean, john dean who was the lawyer in the white house didnt really have the closeness to nixon that any of these three people have. Part of what i imagine is sort of torturous for him and others around him is the secrecy of the proceedings in terms of Robert Muellers movements but also this sort of every day is there going to be something and every day it just keeps going longer and longer. What do you think about the time frame weve watched unfold . The time frame, its been about 19 months since Robert Muellers been in office. I mean, its absolutely remarkable. Hes had 36 indictments, or guilty pleas, which is quite remarkable. Hes basically put together two pieces of the Russian Investigation on the russian side with respect to the breakin at the Democratic National committee and the use of social media. I mean, right now the only question is, you know, what americans, if any, were involved in those conspiracies. Weve got this thing with this ms. Butina now cooperating and youve got this issue out there of whether or not the russians had put money in through the nra to fund the trump campaign. I mean, thats got to be worrying them. And then on top of it all youve got the democrats coming into congress. And before Robert Mueller does anything he is going to want all of those statements released from the house intelligence committee. Right. Because we know that don jr. Was in there. We know that Jared Kushner was in there. And i think theyre going to be looking at those pretty closely before they start bringing indictments. They want to know what all of these people said, and none of this is good news for the white house. And theyve already nailed Michael Cohen on a guilty plea of lying to congress. See if theres more in the offing. Nick akerman, thank you very much. Up next, as the president makes his first trip to visit the troops we discover how he dodged the vietnam war himself, the mystery of trumps bone spurs is solved. Thats next. Hate crime. I was a hell of a good artist and now i can barely write my name. So, i created a world where i can heal. At your service mademoiselle. Are all of the dolls people you know . Yeah, everyone has a place here in marwen. Theres caralala. You cant keep on running away. Julie. You gotta love the pain. Pain is our rocket fuel. Roberta. Back off . And nicol. I just moved in across the street. The only way youre going to get better, is if you face those jerks who beat you up. Im not really sure how to do this. We got your back hogan. We always have your back. From the groundbreaking director of forrest gump. Bottoms up girls. To life, to love. [ gasp ] to the women of marwen. Hell yeah. Maybe the dolls should stay in the car. I never go anywhere without my backup. This holiday season, families near you need your help. Visit redcross. Org now to donate. But prevagen helps your brain with an ingredient originally discovered. In jellyfish. In clinical trials, prevagen has been shown to improve shortterm memory. Prevagen. Healthier brain. Better life. President trumps first ever visit with american troops stationed abroad in conflict zone came in the wake of a stunning resignation of defense secretary james mattis and brett mcgirk, the u. S. Envoy in isis. The president defended his decision. He did not meet with the iraqi Prime Minister. Theres a remarkable report in the New York Times with details of one of the ways donald trump dodged vietnam, bone spurs, which kept him from being drafted a podiatrist in queens, new york who rented his office from trumps said, made the diagnosis as a courtesy to the elder mr. Trump. Joining me now, congressman roe khanna. Youre on the Oversight Committee for armed services, the president making his first trip to troops in a combat zone today where he reiterated the idea that troops could go into syria from iraq in need be in the future and that erdogan has things covered as far as syria goes. What do you think . Well, i obviously dont agree with those details. But any conversation needs to start with this basic fact. The war in syria was illegal under u. S. Law and under international law. Now, democrats, many of us criticized President Trump when he had the syria strikes, a few months ago. We have to be consistent. We have to be principled and say that the withdrawal is compliant with our law and necessary. The way he went about that withdrawal was not right. We should have pressured erdogan to have some agreement not to invade syria and protect the kurds. We shouldnt have agreed to a patriot mitt sill sale with them. We should be consistent about applauding the withdrawal of our forces. What do you think about the departure of mattis and mcgirk, the president saying the following, brett mcgirk had a hold over the obama administration, who was supposed to leave in february, but just resigned prior to leaving. Grand stander . Thats very concerning the president wouldnt know who he was. But on mattis, look, mattis is someone who has served in country well. But lets not be ambiguous about who mattis was. Obama demoted mattis or forced him to retire because mattis was a hawk about getting into war in iran. Mattis has been largely responsible for the war in yemen. So i dont think that we should sort of look at mattiss departure as some earth shattering event. I think the problem has been that there hasnt been a coordinated effort of whats going to fill the vacuum of a withdrawal. You should have had ben rhodes your previous guest said a six many of month plan, there should have been details and coordination with allies. We need George Schultz or bill perry or George Mitchell negotiating things and hopefully hell find someone better than mattis to replace him. You mentioned the saudiled yar in yemen, backed by the u. S. , in terms of equipment and arms sales. Mattis was a huge defender. You have been one of the people in Congress Working most doggedly to try to end that. Theres a successful war powers resolution that passed the senate. The house, paul ryan killed it in the obscure rules maneuver. What happens in the new year in the Democratic Congress on the yemen front . Were going to pass it. Nancy pelosi is going to bring up a vote in january. Its going to pass the house. With republican support. Its going to overwhelmingly pass the senate. I hope the president will sign it. There is a humanitarian catastrophe in yemen, kids are dying every ten minutes. We need to stop the bombing. And we need to allow food and medicine. Were going to make that a huge priority as soon as were back in january. Do you have concerns about the fact theres an acting now whos going to take over department of defense, a deputy to jim mattis, but throughout the this administration theres a real staffing issue. When you think about what would happen in the context of an emergency, like a Genuine National emergency, does it worry you at all . It does. If we saw the consequences of that, in this withdrawal in syria, the details on these things actually matter, even if the instinct and gut is right to withdraw troops, it matters how youre negotiating with erdogan. It matters what youre telling sdf. It matters if you can get iran and russia to the table with turkey and have a complicated negotiation. And thats why usually president s who succeed in negotiation have huge teams with them. Right. And they have people who work with them with expertise. Thats whats been missing in this administration. Congressman ro khanna, thanks for taking some time. Wild swings in the stock market as the administration indulges in some truly bizarre behavior, the president versus economics, next. Jardiance asked when it comes to managing your type 2 diabetes, what matters to you . Step up to the stage here. Feeling good about that . Lets see most of you say lower a1c. But only a few of you are thinking about your heart. Fact is, even though it helps to manage a1c, type 2 diabetes still increases your risk of a fatal heart attack or stroke. Jardiance is the first type 2 diabetes pill with a lifesaving cardiovascular benefit for adults who have type 2 diabetes and heart disease. 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Tell your doctor about all the medicines you take and if you have any medical conditions. Sowhat do you think . Well im definitely thinking differently than i was yesterday. Ask your doctor about jardiance and get to the heart of what matters. Markets rally today, not enough to make up for a months long slide. President trumps erratic behavior on his attacks of chairman jerome powell, followed by the bizarre decision by Steve Mnuchin to issue an unprompted statement, people not on a financial crisis, came out of nowhere and made people wonder. Key economic numbers like the Unemployment Rate are still looking good, as well as holiday sales, theres a lot of anxiety in markets about where were headed. Alexis goldsteen, alexis, ill start with you. He puts out this one paragraph statement, everythings fine, everyones got enough liquidity. Its like a waiter coming to you we want to assure you theres no glass anywhere in any of these dishes youre eating, its totally fine. What the heck was that . Yeah, i mean, the first rule of markets is when theres already a panic you dont tell everybody to relax. Its sort of like markets 101. But i think, you know, its sort of funny to laugh at mnuchin. Hes your classic wall street guy, he game from goldman sachs. He foreclosed on 50,000 people. I would actually argue some of this market jitters and volatility is the direct by product of the policy all of these wall street bankers that trump chose to fill his administration with have been making, right, they deregulated a huge portion of the dot frank act, janet yellen has been warning about debt markets overheating. Theyve been making policy choices to let wall street one wild and when they run wild they get reckless and thats dangerous and it leads to crises. Thats a good point. Weve seen this before. John, you wrote a piece about the sort of the economy and the president s political fortunes. I thought it was good. One thing i think we overlook is how strong from a Macro Economic sense under trump because of the extended recovery. When people say nothing matters, still has 40 approval, the economy does matter for how people think about the politics of the presidency. Yeah, the economy does matter and the point i was trying to make is you can make an argument for what trump is saying about Interest Rates. You can make a decent case that we need to keep Interest Rates low because the economy is soft and has a lot of room to grow. But if you make that case, it totally undermines everything hes been saying in public about how this is the greatest economy ever. So its kind of clear he doesnt believe what hes been saying for the last two years. Right. The idea being if the economy and the recovery are so robust, that then it can take a few it can take a few fed rate hikes because its strong and it will keep going. But if youre freaking about that it shows that you actually think the economy is actually kind of weak and vulnerable. Right. Now, of course, we cant put it past trump to hold totally contradictory thoughts inside his head. But i wanted to point out these things dont make any sense together. The other thing is that janet yellen would have been a lot less likely to raise rates than jay powell. And trump made the choice to not reappoint janet yellen. He thought she was too short. Shes 53, and therefore he wanted someone taller. Thats what the Washington Post reported. If he wanted someone who wasnt going to raise rates he could have stuck with janet yellen, but he didnt. Its one of the most insane and delicious ironies in this era, the first woman to ever run, who did an incredibly good job, i think, by and large, who actually sympathetic to the inclination trump has gets canned because shes too short replaced with a guy, who, john, trump is now railing against in public, to play the obama had done game, the kind of like bright line towards dictatorship conservatives tend to freak out about. Reportedly hes telling people that powell is going to turn him into a herbert hoover. Thats how concerned he is about the economy, which seems a little overheated to me. But it would be kind of ironic if he was hoisted by his own patard of sexism, firing the praised Federal Reserve chairman for not being tall enough. Maybe theres some binders on high shelves on the Federal Reserve he didnt think she could reach, or something. Obviously a sexist assessment of her fine work. I dont really know if she would be doing a different job, but at least he could wonder, maybe, if he has the selfawareness of maybe he made a mistake. Alexis, obviously the sort of political economy of the Federal Reserve is complicated. Theres this idea of independence and the important of that, and sometimes i think thats been taken way too far to the detriment of the real economy. This is sort of uncharted waters, the current dynamic between the sitting president of the United States and the fed chair at this moment. I think so. But i also think, look, the president has a bully pulpit. So long as he doesnt fire chair powell hes allowed to mouth off on twitter about it. Trump and wall street are the same, you know, and wall street was all in favor of making may knew shin, wanted to get their millionaire and billionaire tax cut, and deregulation. If you find someone whos ignorant enough to weve you the entire store youre also going to have to deal with the crazy that comes with it. Trump and wall street are the same. They blame everyone for their mistakes, they ask for everything. They organize their own demise because they ask for too much. They have no selfrestraint, you know, they cant selfregulate and, you know, basically theyre the same. They deserve each other. And the sad thing is, you know, were all along for the ride. Theres never been a cliche more true and more in evidence this year than the buy on the rumor, sell on the news clie shae about wall street, they bought on the rumor of the tax cut and boy are they selling on the news after it gets its way into the economy. Jonathan and alexis, thank you. Next up, democrats are promising to hold the Administration Accountable as a second child dies in u. S. Custody at the border. Congresswoman annette barrigan is with me next. How much horse power does this thing got . Doing great dad looking good babe are you filming. At booking. Com, we cant guarantee youll be any good at that water jet thingy. But we can guarantee the best price on a hotel, like this one. Or any home, boat, treehouse, yurt, whatever. Get the best price on homes, hotels and so much more. Booking. Com, booking. Yeah for the second time this month, a child has died in the custody of u. S. Customs and border protection. The agency reported yesterday an 8yearold boy from guatemala died shortly before midnight on december 24th at Gerald Champion Regional Medical Center in new mexico. Cpb has not released the boys name but House Democrats have identified him as filipe gomez. Last tuesday he and his father were apprehended three miles west of the port of entry in el paso. On Christmas Eve, a number of days later, the boy had quote glossy eyes about 9 00 a. M. , hospitalized, diagnosed with a common cold. Despite a 103 degree he was released to a temporary holding facility. That night around 10 00, he appeared lethargic, began to vomit and lost consciousness, two hours later he was pronounced dead. Two weeks after a 7yearold girl died herself. House majority leader announced plans for hearings into both these deaths and conditions under which children are being held. Joining me is nanette barragan, last on the program when she was down on the border near san diego. What are the questions you want answered about what happened here . Well, i think one of the Big Questions is asking about the medical procedures and the screening. We here at cpb often talk about how parents said their kids were okay. What we really need is for cpb to do real medical streenings. That is a problem now. It was an issue with jakeliny, making shaur they making sure theyre taking vital signs. If you see theres 103 temperature, there needs to be better observation. Im not a medical expert, chris, but let me tell you when you hear the news that it took roughly an hour just to get the child back to the hospital, and then you hear that he started vomiting and it took four hours to get the child back to the hospital, thats a concern. So we need to ask those questions. We also need to ask about some of the attitudes that some of the cbp officers having, having heard firsthand some of their attitudes at the border and their just disregard for human life, that is a question we also need to ask about. There are lots of questions, and certainly resources. Let me stop you there. What do you mean by that . We had you last on the program as you were working with the woman who, i believe, was from honduras. Maria. Maria who had been tear gassed with her children, that photo of getting her through. You tweeted about what you heard the kind of comments from cbp. What do you mean by that . Well, sit tlg with two female officers talking about how migrants were terrible people, coming to commit crime, and she was even commenting, oh, when crime happens in the u. S. , then we come begsing for them asking for help. Its this attitude, this arrogance of what they feel, how they feel about migrants that is concerning. And it makes me it makes me wonder if that plays a role in not getting medical attention quickly and not really treating these people like humans. If you talk to my colleagues who have seen these detention areas, it is inhumane to be treating people the way they are. This is what Kirstjen Nielsen said, her statement on the death of this young boy from guatemala, it has been more than a decade since cbp has had a child pass away during custody. These migrants are harboring illness caused from their long journey. What do you think . Its disgusting. Its plain disgusting. No compassion. Playing the blame game again instead of looking at their own policies. This is the result of this president and this administrations cruel, inhumane, antiimmigrant policies, turning people away at ports of entry when they get them, not making sure they have the proper medical screenings. To hear that, chris, is just really sad, especially around this time of the year. It would be nice if the secretary takes some responsibility and making sure we have accountability over this agency. Final question here, what do you think the administrations policies at ports of entry were there doing whats called metering, not letting people through, attempting to make it as hard as possible to come in and ask for asylum legally, do you think thats causing more danger to the people in question . Theres no doubt. When youre in congress, we have hearings and they say just present yourself at a port of entry. I saw firsthand last week that is not the case. Theyre turning people away. Even have tactics to try to get them off u. S. Soil to go back onto mexican soil so that they can apprehend them. It is not the way its supposed to be done and i believe its a violation to do those things that we saw last week. People are desperate. They are going to go between the points of entry. And it is going to be more dangerous if they cant just go present themselves at a port of entry. And so theres no doubt we have heard stories of people saying ive been waiting, im desperate, and thats why i had to cross in a different manner between the ports of entry. Congresswoman nanette barragan, thank you very much. Still ahead from the shutdown to the surprise trip to iraq to the Christmas Eve tweet storm to the president well try to put this extraordinary week, its only wednesday, in perspective ahead. See, esurance knows its confusing. I literally have no idea what im getting. I dont know either. Im just the spokesperson. But thats why theyre making it simple so that even actors, like us, can understand it. Im not an actor. 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Its a special holiday treat, we are now revisiting one of my alltime favorite episodes with literally my favorite person. On the rule of law in the era of donald trump, featuring the greatest lawyer, kate shaw, who along with having worked at the white house under president obama clerked on the Supreme Court for justice stevens, also happens to be my wife. You can listen and subscribe, wherever you get your podcasts. Its time for our lowest prices of the season on the new sleep number 360 smart bed. It senses your movement and automatically adjusts to keep you both comfortable. And now, the queen sleep number 360 c4 smart bed is only 1299. Plus, 24month financing on all beds. Ends new years day. Its been a week and its only wednesday. Here to talk through it all with me are my guests. Curt, let me start with you. You used to work at breitbart before you left. Ive been thinking about the ways in which Breitbart Fox news and others are calling the shots, like we its not an overstatement to say we are in a Government Shutdown now because rush bilimbaugh, ann coulter an fox news were upset the president didnt get his wall. We had a deal, and as soon as the ann coulters and rush limb balks went enplektic over it, donald trump changed. If he loses any part of his coalition he has left, its over for him. Betsy, thats the way hes thinking about it. But i also think its a broader phenomena, republicans are just much more scared of their base than democrats. Partly thats the media environment. There was reporting about the last shutdown, and republicans werent worried because their base doesnt believe any of it any way. But what they are scared of is their base and the media environment that their base listens to. I think thats accurate. Another piece of this thats important is the way the shutdown played out points to the ascent of very conservative House Republicans having the president s ear. I remember representatives mark meadows and jim jordan were out front loud and clear saying the president would be, you know, be failing were he tomanding money from the congress. So were seeing a shift to who the president is listening to. Rather than listening to the traditional republican voices who almost got him to keep the government open, at the last moment, trump changed. One thing i can tell you is part of the calculation that people in that orbit and close allies of the president are making is if this shutdown goes on through the beginning of Nancy Pelosis ascent to the speakership, their hope is it will have the effect of her overshad e doing of her taking that role and shifting the conversation away and toward Donald Trumps favorite topic, which is, of course, the wall. Thats remarkably cynical. But now we have ann coulter as the jimny cricket of donald trump who wants a white christmas. We saw it in the midterm election. He doubled down while unemployment was at 3. 7 and there was job growth and he doubled down on the caravan story. Terrorists, rapists, invasion, criminals, swarm, middle eastern suspects. And you sit there and think you have one of the most robust, bullish economies well, you did. And yet you double down on the caravan to kate tore the small minority base, which is, im sorry to say, fueled by White Nationalism and i think its correct. The last the record for the longest shutdown was 21 days in 1995 under clinton. I think hell extend it to placate that base. I think he will. Then the question becomes whether mcconnell goes along with that, which i think he will. When it goes on long enough, its anyones guess. But what is interesting is you think about wedge issues and polarizing issues, i think about george w. Bushs morally bankrupt use of Marriage Equality in 2004. At least they were right about what the majority view was, right . It was cynical, but they were on the right side of the wedge. They were on the 55 side of the 5545 issue. In this case, the more he talks about the wall, the less popular he gets. Everything he touches on immigration produces more support for the opposite view. Remember, they went allin, no pun intended, on the idea that building the wall, National Security, stopping the caravan would be enough to stave off the midterm debacle that they just experienced. It is amazing that they are doubling down on a failed strategy, rejected overwhelmingly by the American People, resulting many 40 seats being lost in the house and theyre parading out there like that didnt happen. The fundamental thing is, hes trying to get money for a wall that he said mexico was going to fund. Like, the money shouldnt even be this there. Lets remember the wholesales pitch. It was a onetwo. It was wall, mexico is going to pay for it. I watched him say it a thousand times until my eyeing started to fall out of my head, and now he wants americans to pay for it. Its obviously a losing political issue to me. Thats not the view that exists in the white house, and in certain corners of republicans on capitol hill. One of the challenges when we talk about these immigration issues is that pulling it can be really challenging, the way pollsters put their questions together, often the intensity and the mobilization levels of people who are very passionately in trumps camp when it comes to immigration, who are dogmatically committed to reducing not just ilLegal Immigration levels but Legal Immigration levels. That doesnt always register in some of these polls, including polls of the republican primary. You can find poll after poll showing the majority of 2016 primary voters supported an immigration policy wanted more what jeb bush was pushing for than what donald trump was pushing for. But history shows us that doesnt reflect where these voters are at, and President Trump believes his intuition is more correct than these numbers are. Thats a great point about the preference intensity problem on il gration. What we have seen in america, as long as ive been covering immigration policy, is the steve kings of the world and the steven millers of the world, and the white nationalists have essentially a veto on American Immigration policy because the intensity with which they feel it. Fear, hate, anger sells. Facts matter. Its no longer a wall. Its beautiful, steel slats, esthetically pleasing. Facts matter. And over 17 years, theres been 80 reduction of apprehensions by Border Patrol at the border. Foreign born individuals in america have less criminal history than those born here. This demonization process against jews, catholics, the lbgt is the cynical but successful strategy of politicians of past, present, and unfortunately republicans right now. Yeah. Well see im curious to see how the dynamics shift starting january 3rd in terms of how long they can sustain this. Thank you very much. That is all in this evening. The Rachel Maddow show starts right now with joy reid in for rachel. Have a good night. Thanks to you at home for joining us this hour. And happy day after christmas to all of you. Also known in the uk as boxing day. And here in the u. S. As day one of kwanzaa. So keep on celebrating if youre still holidaying. If youre one of the 800,000 or so federal workers that had today off not because its part of your holiday vacation but because the government is shut down, today is not a great day. The shutdown stories is where federal workers worry about paying the rent or working without pay period, have gathered on twitter to share their stories. Donald trump has storied, too. Before jetting