heard from very high posts in his cabinet. it's not a united message. do you have an issue with that? >> i do. i do. look, this has been from inauguration i think the president has done a lot of good things but has derailed his message off arguments about crowd sizes, this kind of thing. i've said on torture and i hope this is really where the president is i've only heard what you have seen, but i hope in extreme circumstances when we have thousands of americans lives and we know a bomb is going to go off in an hour an we need to find out where it is we need to have tools in our pockets. i've been through interrogation techniques, not waterboarding, but it's not most effective, the most effective is getting people in your confidence an getting them to spill the beans, but at the end of the day i don't think we can rule it out entirely