the shutdown i posited to you is a lousy mechanism to get your wall and your money, you've got no answer for this. >> i have an answer. >> do you think they should reopen the government? >> i think the objective is not to reopen the government but to secure our nation. that's the objective. >> why do it on the backs of these american families? >> it shouldn't be done on the backs of the american families. >> but you're doing it on their backs. >> no, chris. >> yes. >> this is a situation that needs to be dealt with and it needs to be dealt with now. >> amy, i heard you. now, luis, it was very upsetting to listen to joe manchin. he's a democrat but on the republican side in the senate you have the problem. mcconnell won't put him any votes on the floor until the president gives him a pat on the head. what is the move for democrats to get this government back open. >> here's what i think. this is donald trump's shutdown of the government. and let's not keep talking about